What should we do? Is this legal?

Since the Infant has already been born in the Phillipines. What you have even if they come to America is an International Adoption. The laws are very different than Domestic! You have to go through the Phillipines, and Immigration also besides the Facilitator! In order to obtain Citizenship, the Baby has to by Phillipine Law legally declared an 'Orphan' first in the Phillipines. They do not have Open Adoption situations. I have helped Families who are biologically related and want better lives for their relatives try and Adopt from the Phillipines. There is a lot of 'red tape' involved even with this in regards to Adoption! It's not as easy as she comes over and 'gives you the Baby'. Immigration will need a copy of your Homestudy by an Internationally Licensed Agency. for approval first also before the child comes! Mariever or Mariver is a Social Worker in the Phillipines in Member Profiles. She could probably offer you more Assistance? You are looking at a cost of upwards of $20,000 including Immigration, and related costs!

I would agree JuliannaTeresa, it does sound like you're headed for a big mess if you try to go around the system like this. I have to wonder about your facilitator? How well do you know them? It's a basic question but have you checked them out with DSWD. Don't do it this way! Jump through all the hoops and sit when they tell you to. Don't doom this kids future with you. The laws are not the same with domestic and international adoption. I have no doubt that you will need legal representation, in the Philippines and in the US, if you go ahead with this plan. I seem to recall our lawyer mention that it was against the law for domestic adoptions to be granted for the purpose of immigration even if the bio-mother surrenders the child. He showed me a supreme court's ruling rejecting a lower counts final decree. I felt heart-broken for the parents because I know it's about the rules and not the child. So unless you have been resident for three years in the Philippines and plan on being resident for another two years after you are granted legal custody, the domestic way shouldn't be a preference. The exception to the residency requirement is if you or your wife are related to the child within the 4-degree and then your round robin to internation adoption and have to go through ICAB. I don't know what the effects are if you go ahead but they can't be any good. Lawyers set their fees based on what they think they can get out of you. Your interest and their interest is a conflict from the start. The more "you" know about the whole process the more you will be able to save. If you can afford to pay for someone else to think for you, then plan like "JuliannaTeresa" wrote on paying over $20,000. There are no loop holes unless you have the political connections to get the bureaucracy to work for you. It took us a very long time to find the "right" help, but we think we did. The DWSD. HTH, Johnny

Thank you for your input. That is what we wanted. Does anyone know if we would have to go there and be interviewed before we are able to adopt? How long does the whole process take? Thank you so much.

... the website of the U.S. State Department. Go to [url]http://travel.state.gov/adopt,[/url] and click on "The Philippines." Sharon

I'm not advocating doing something illegal or underhanded, I was just wondering what the implications would be if the b-mom entered the USA before she gave birth. What if she gave here? Wouldn't the baby then be a US citizen and the adoption be completed as a normal domestic one. Again, I am not advocating this.....just wondering. Sincerely, Sag

saj, the way I understand it is that many (most? all?) countries have laws prohibiting encouraging a person to travel "for the purpose of placing a child for adoption". I have heard the Marshall Islands have a law like that, and some other countries. I would imagine it would be hard to prove that nobody encouraged a mother to do that, if indeed she showed up in a country with preselected adoptive parents and gave birth and surrendered the baby to them. Might present a legal problem at some later date.

This is just not so Johnny. I am sure that there might be some lawyers out there that would do this, but in every state that i know of this would be either illegal or a violation of a state's ethical codes. Generally lawyers bill by the hour or set their flat fees based upon the expected amount of work. I don't care if you paid (and could afford) $30,000 or $10,000 for your agency adoption, I charge about the same to finalize. The only variable is my experience with a certain agency and how much work they will have done v. how much I will have to do. My client's income has NOTHING to do with what I charge. Yes, there are international laws that prohibit a mother from doing some of the things talked about here. Stick with a reputable agency/facilitator and you will be more secure and much happier in the long run. Note also that the ones who are willing to bend the rules will also be MUCH more likely to start milking you for fees throughout the process. -Scott

Scott, maybe your fees are specialized and you are an exception with ethics? Let me put out some realism info for you here. Conflicts: Attorneys provide services. The more services they provide, the more money an Attorney can make. The more hearings it takes to complete a case, the more an Attorney makes. The longer an Attorney works on a case, the more expenses he incurs, the more money an Attorney makes. Who, in general, makes the rules? Attorneys. Who makes it difficult for the layman to understand the rules? Attorneys. Who benefits from a difficult process? Attorneys. I've been to three lawyers in California all of them asked me about my employment before giving me a price. The last lawyer I went to claimed to be the largest immigration firm in the US. Simply put, I am seeking an experienced attorney that understands the rules regarding adoption abroad and the two years legal custody requirement. I initially addressed this in our petition however my understanding was lacking as was the information provided on the embassy web site for Manila. We only included custody rather than "legal custody" in our petition. We would like it, if there can be no argument about when the clock starts and want experienced help before the final decree is issued. I explained the above summary in a detailed letter to the lawyers providing background to our case making it clear that our child is not qualified for inter-country adoption. The lawyers I have talked with, after sending my letter, either failed to read my letter before consultation or asked for a consultation fee up front. (For what? To tell me they have no experience? $240, $500, $200 etc.) I have been told that I have approached the case the wrong way and should have used the I-600a pre approval process. (They don't even know the status of the bparents before suggesting this process nor do they explain the other costs involved and in their contracts add "that in addition to the retainer fee, I must also pay for expenses"; all of this is conveniently left out during the consultation) What I have written is so, and I can prove it with more specifics. I can go on with examples and generalizations that personify the profession. However, I wasn't making the premise to put down the lawyer's profession but rather to emphasize that because the poster has doubts about the ethics of his facilitator. The right help in this case should start with the DSWD Now, I didn't post this before, but frankly, I didn't think it, I just felt it. This facilitator smells more and more like a SCAM!

HI, My adivice is don't go through an attorney. The Philippine government will not accept the adoption. Also, laws in the Philippines state that you cannot by any means choose your child you want to adopt, unless you are related. If you are Filipino the time to do the entire adoption can be about 1 year, and if you are not it averages about 1 1/2 years - The birth mother has to sign a form stating that she gives up complete parental rights to her baby, and this is done with the Philippine government. If she does bring the baby to the U.S. they will most likely deport the child back, unless the adoption has been done correctly. Good luck!