relative adoption timeframe

Could you explain to me what is consanguinity. I heard from social workers using the term degree of sanguinity in relative adoption. What do they mean ? We are not at all confident about ICAB procedure. It is even scarey that they can lost your file altogether ! Something terribly wrong out there.

Consanguinuity is blood relationship. 1st level is your blood relationship with your parents. 2nd level is either your children, siblings or grandparents. The 3rd and 4th level can be your grandchildren, niceces/nephews, uncles/aunts and first cousins.

I wasn't aware you could adopt past the 4th level of consanguinuity. Can you explain where you discovered that it was possible to do this? I'm asking because we may be in the same situation.

First, get yourself a bottle of scotch. If you don't drink, you will by the time you're done. [THIS IS A JOKE] Second, contact ICAB, the authority on International Adoption in the Philippines. Each adoption is different after all we're dealing with children not manufactured goods. Third, the ICAB is a GOOD THING regardless of what you read. Cambodia is closed. Vietnam is closed. Philippines is open. I'd rather have a slow process than no process. Fourth, adopting past the 4th level is possible. My cousin in Holland adopted a relative but it happened before ICAB was created. Fifth, enjoy the journey otherwise you'll be posting your misery on this forum.

Thanks for the response. You said that your cousin adopted a relative before the ICAB was created. Is that the only basis you have for believing that adopting past the 4th consanguinuity is possible? I'm just wondering how much these rules can be stretched.

Read the first post. I posed that question to which no one responded. Not even a peep from the filipino adoption forum gurus. PM me if you have specific questions.

Hi All, Our Lawyer explained the relation requirement to my wife and I when we were hoping to avoid the residency rule. He used two terms that were allowed with the 4th degree requirement i.e. "consanguinity" which is blood relation and "affinity" which is relation thru marriage. I was not able to locate any specific text in Philippine Law which depicts the counting method. It's important because there are different methods of counting depending on the application. This question will remain open to a degree, (no pun intended) until someone can post the actual text of Law or at least a link. This is one chart that I found in my search that I think matches the application however I'm not 100% sure. [url]http://www.answers.com/topic/consanguinity[/url] if the relation is close then consult a Lawyer before coming to a conclusion. What I can tell you for sure is that my wife's cousin's niece's child is considered at least the 5th degree and possible the 6th and my wife and I successfully completed the adoption. Note however that it is not technically considered a relative adoption nor was it considered orphan adoption. Since the child was already identified, ICAB refused get involved without a court order. In fact we were turned away by ICAB on three separate occasions while seeking their assistance. So if your are not related within the 4th degree then ICAB will not assit you. I strongly recommend that you contact DSWD "Childrens Wlefare" instead (I've posted links before) they will assist you and can help you get a Lawyer to handle your case. If you are resident outside the Philippines then you will need a social agency to assist you as well with the case study requirements. Under the current rules if you are not a resident then you will not be able to adopt. If the child is not classified as an orphan or qualified by ICAB for InterCountry adoption then the child will not be able to immigrate upon completion of the adoption unless you have travel authorization from DSWD. If you want to immigrate to the US then you'll have to meet the two year co-residency requirements. IMHO, I think ICAB is confused about it's identy as an agency. This is a bad thing for many a child's needs and It's a good thing for a many a child's protection. The people in the Judical system and the policy makers need to realize that when rules are made they are for the people that follow the rules. People that don't follow the rules don't care because they are not bound by the rules. I met one Lawyer Firm representative that claimed to complete an adoption/immigration to the US in 8 months time. I didn't believe him. In my exposure to the process I found that some on a fast track were able to complete adoptions within a year. But note that these adoptions were within the 4th degree and required corners to be cut. I have not met or corresponded with anyone that has completed a non-relative non-orphan adoption process in less than 2 years and the average is more like 3 to 3.5 years. It took my brother-in-law and his wife 2.5 years to complete an identified child adoption using the I-600 processs however in this case ICAB was involved. HTH, Johnny

Thank you Johnny. The problem most people WILL run into is that no one really knows the process to adopt a relative. We contacted ICAB, they told us to contact DSWD, who referred us to an attorney, who told us to contact ICAB. ICAB -> DSWD -> ATTORNEY -> ICAB Government agencies are the same regardless of what language they speak.

I couldn't agree more... The process is the same... (Lawyers make the rules as messed up as possible because its in their interest $$$. - just venting here) The Regional Trial Court will review your petition for Adoption and either approve or deny it based on the evidence submitted in accordance with Philippine Law. The Social System deals with the placement of the child and the child's welfare. ICAB is involved when a child is being adopted through the Intercountry process and coordinates the childstudy/homestudy requirements. However ICAB takes on a little more role than social work because they also create policy for the Intercountry process. Sort of like the tail waving the dog. It's a process game that has to be played and you need an astute Lawyer to work the system. We learned the hard way just submitting the forms will most likely get you denied. The Lawyer you spoke with most likely didn't want to handle your case (because it's tough) or is not savvy enough about your type of case. It's a level of service you have to deal with. Unless you know people, the only thing you can do to get serviced is throw lots of $$$ at it. (Responsibly) When you got your reference, did you go in person to the DSWD office on Legard St. or just call? I sent you a PM. Johnny

Johnny, I'm a little startled at your time frames for completion of adoption. Do you define that as from the time of application to the bringing of the child to the adopter's country, or the final legal process formalizing the adoption in that country?

To answer your specific question: The 2.5 years above was from the hiring date of the Lawyer involved. This type of adoption is not applying as a perspective adoptive parent to bring a child home. Everything depends on your particular situation and the situation of the relative child you want to adopt. Most of this thread addresses the "possibility" of adopting a relative past the 4th degree of relation through ICAB or using the Intercountry process. (I-600). This is a very complicated and involves following both the rules that ICAB has laid out and most of all the best interest of the child. Adopting a pre-Identified child through ICAB (I almost miss-typed "ICAN") is "NOT" something nearly all perspective adoptive parents can achieve nor should they even considered it. It can tear-up your heart. My wife and I were turned away by ICAB and had to complete our adoption using the domestic process. The Intercountry rules starting from the Hague needs reform to include real life situations. Adoptive parents and children that need a home don't always fit the mold. The rules were designed primarily to protect children and need to be adjusted for the best interest of the children. According to the rules and from our experience, If you have contact with the child prior to ICAB and DSWD's involvement other than what is written under the rules, ICAB will turn you away. There is a global community that my wife and I have been a part of. I know of OFW's, Immigrants and relatives that have been in similar situations adopting relatives. Except for one couple, All that I know personally have gone through the Regional Trial Courts and those immigrating to the US went through the I-130 process. I understand from DSWD social workers that they have many clients waiting for the two-year custody requirement. To sum this up; I will simply say that ICAB has to qualify the child for the Intercountry process. Now after having written all that if you are related within the 4th degree then the RTC can waive your residency requirement and the time frame can be quicker. How much quicker? I understand that ICAB works with your agency to get it done and you still have to wait in line for your case to be processed. If you are already pre-qualified (I-600a) then the time frame is a little more than what ICAB posts on their web site. If you were not confused before you should be now....I think I wrote to much here.... PM me if you need some more info. HTH, at least a little Johnny