Starting the process with questions and concerns...

I'm not an adoptive parent, but I work with kids and I have had two kids that I have been working with fairly recently that were adopted and having some pretty serious issues with behavior and such. One of the adoptions disrupted after 7 years and the other one probably will very soon. A few things that I would suggest looking at are number of placements prior to you all, if any way possible I would see if you can talk to any of the previous foster parents to ask about behaviors. One of the kids that I am working with always "LOVES" the last set of foster parents, while with the new ones, but HATED them while she was living with them, if possible look at school info, look at medications, if you see adhd meds, depression meds, anti psychotics be aware that they will probably be on those for quite some time. Try to get parent mental health info because some of the more severe psychiatric issues don't start popping up till later teens. If you do pre adoption visits note maturity level, if they are really immature they may not be able to function alone at 18, the adoption that disrupted the mom said she planned to have both boys join the military at 18 and the parents were going to move. Neither of those boys were going to be accepted into the military at 18 and I knew that after two weeks. Be aware that dhr may not know, or may not tell you all past info. Good luck, I hope that everything works out well for you. :-)

Thank you! Great advice. Do some states not do pre-adoptive placements? Our state requires it for at least 6 months before adoption can be finalized.

I don't know, it would seem like there would be some type of pre placement visits set up for people. Both of the kids that I was working with that were adopted were in the homes as foster children first and then later adopted, so I'm guessing that was the prior to adoption placements. That's Alabama, but I don't know what the official "rules" are for the state. :-)

They do. You can't finalize immediately. You have some very specific and easily identifiable criteria. You want someone who thinks they would enjoy some adventurous outdoor activities. That is likely to be achievable. We were looking for something similar. Our boys definitely like that sort of stuff. Unfortunately now we've decided that one of them will never be allowed to rappel again because he disassociates when he gets scared. He spaces out, lets go, and the laws of nature take over. It is a PTSD response. There is no way we could have known that prior to finalization. It took a lot of time to get to the point where we found it out and you can't let the kids do anything that a judge thinks is dangerous until you finalize. I'm not saying we want to give him back or anything. You won't be able to take your kid kayaking for awhile. Most families don't have specific requirements based on their lifestyle. I think most of the matching problems have to do with how hard the kid's behaviors are. Kids with hard behaviors are not really a "match" for any civilized home. It is a lot easier to say that they weren't a match than it is to say "I wasn't tough enough, creative enough, resilient enough, or patient enough to handle them". Adoptive families tend to have more interest in molding the kids into responsible adults than foster families. In our experience, many (not all) foster families are mostly interested in keeping the peace. They do so with medications, TV, video games, and shopping sprees. The kids get everything they want and little of what they really need. They are totally unprepared for life in a real family where personal development and a two way relationship is expected. So, yeah, in some cases the kids really do want to go back--back to foster care until they are 18 and then straight to jail.

Thanks Jeff! That explains a lot. We do understand that whitewater kayaking may be a little over-the-top for some of the kids, but fortunately we can do a little flat water kayaking (lakes and calm rivers) and hiking/camping otherwise. However, you bring up a very interesting point as well that we didn't even think of with the PTSD. Thanks so much for the response!

Your idea to adopt a teen is a wonderful thing. Just Please know you may not know alot about the kids until they live with you for quite a while. Also please take everything you read/hear with a grain of salt and request all the info you can get. Talk to the foster family the child is with currently. Especially if the child has been in care for a while and had more than one placement. Question why no one has wanted to adopt this child yet. My husband and I were very naive starting the process. We too wanted an older child. We were placed with a 10 year old beautiful little girl who for the first few months was a princess. Her former foster parents tried to warn us about some of the behaviors, but DSS jumped in and said they didn't know about any problems, they had talked to the schools and summer camps and she had been perfect for two years. A few days after she was placed with us DSS gave us a file they had promised before placement that showed she may have fetal alcohol spectrum disorder. I now deal with memory issues and the fallout from them on a daily basis. Two months after she was placed with us she accused me of inappropriately touching her and DSS had to come out. Luckily for me, she chose to say it was just a joke instead of filing charges. We continued with the same therapist, because we are in a rural area and not many therapists take medicare, but instead of helping when my home began to descend into chaos she just handed me a paper of what we needed to work on and on it, it said attachment issues. This is even though DSS flat out denied to me that there was an attachment disorder. Also no one shared that she had a raging eating disorder(compulsive overeating). It makes Easter, Halloween and any kind of all you can eat buffet or school party a nightmare. On top of that she is emotionally about 3, so we have a 10 year old, 3 year old who looks like a 15 yr old and is beginning puberty. Unchecked this could be a recipe for disaster. In addition, because of her age and the RAD our new therapist who specifically works with RAD children has told us the dynamic of our home is not the greatest, our son is only 9 months older and she is ripe to start acting out sexually if we do not get things under control. Every day my husband and I question what we have done to our home and whether or not we will make it or even want to. Then we come back to who else is going to do all of this for her? As I believe Jeffw mentioned most foster parents(not the pre-adoptive) will not got out of their way for the kids. The same thing was told to us by a social worker in another county. DSS has not had a hand in setting up any of the therapy even though they had a report about the FASD and actually called and had quite a terse chat with me and implied I was weak because things were affecting me so deeply. I do not want to scare you in any way, you could do a great thing for a child who really needs you, just please go into this with your eyes wide open, unlike me and don't be afraid to battle with DSS when you need resources. Dn't let them brush things under the rug, so to speak and hope for the best outcome, as they did with us.

I want to share a different experience with you. I in no way want to dismiss or minimize the lived experience of so many other parents who have adopted older children. I understand that for many it has held challenges they could never have imagined. However, for us it has been nothing but wonderful, and I wanted you to know that such an experience is possible. Our daughter was 12 when she was placed with us, and we finalized the adoption shortly after her 13th birthday. She is 16 now and continues to absolutely flourish. She was taken into care when she was 8 years old due to serious neglect. In the four years before she came to us she lived in two foster homes, one of which was abusive (for a year) and one where she was loved (for 3 years). The second foster home didn't adopt her because they are a foster-only couple with grown children and grandchildren and they are simply not interested in adopting at this stage in their lives. We received full disclosure about her background, met with her foster parents, teachers and a neuropsychologist who had assessed her the previous year. Unlike the experience many here have had, the information we received was quite accurate. In fact, we found that they rather underestimated what she is capable of. She was described as sweet, loving and kind, with a below-average IQ. They were cautious about her academic potential, but we have found her to be able to do so much more than they said. To meet her, you would have no idea that she has any cognitive deficit. She is perfectly capable of being on her own after school, and she even babysits on occasion for her 2 year old nephew. The social worker told us that she did not exhibit any behavioral problems at all, and the foster mom and teachers backed that up. We were skeptical, but that really has turned out to be the truth. In four years, the worst behaviour we have ever seen is two incidents of lying to avoid getting in trouble (about chore completion). She's not perfect - her room's a mess, we have to nag her to do chores, she doesn't always get all her homework done on time - in other words, a perfectly typical teenager. I would like to be able to take all the credit for what a wonderful girl she is, but so much of it is just her. Don't get me wrong, I think my partner and I are excellent parents, and I know that the way in which we parent has had a huge impact on how smoothly this process has gone. But so much of it is J's own inherent strength and resilience. She is really able to "go with the flow" and she really lives in the moment. She truly is one of the most extraordinary people I know.

I think there are many misconceptions in your original post, but it is understandable because I think most parents who fail with these kids tried, but have no idea why they failed. They've had or are having a miserable time and don't know what to do about it. You should understand that some of these forums represent a safe place to vent, get advice, and talk to people when social workers are often not safe. Other people are so hurt that they just want to scare off anyone else from being hurt the way they were. Just like any other online format, it's easier to complain than to give helpful advice. Jeff hits the matching question directly, basically having some common interests with your kids helps. If they really like computer games and you don't own a computer, you might struggle to find things to do together. That aside, kids learn from their parents, and do what their parents do because that's what they are exposed to. All of our kids are in karate and have worked at it diligently for years. Not because they all had an interest before coming to us, but because that is what we do as a family. And yes, all states require at least six months before you finalize. But, that six months is not a trial period, it's barely even a fail-safe. When your kids move in, they have to be YOUR kids, and you have to give them all your heart. Not because they like kayaking, or laugh alot, or look like you, but because you make a CHOICE to commit your love to them. That commitment should not be contingent on anything they do or any behavior they show. Almost all parents give their birth children that commitment, why would an adoptive child deserve any less? As for new behaviors showing up, it happens all the time as part of the healing process. Kids in foster care are often in survival mode, they guard their hearts and try not to make their foster parents mad. It takes months or years until they start to feel safe, and that is when they open their hearts and the pain pours out. When that happens, it can be rough for everyone in the house. Or, it can just be sobering, like when our 5th, the night after we finalized her adoption, sat at the kitchen table and started sobbing endlessly in the middle of dinner. She was 12, and after sitting with her on the floor, holding her for two hours, she could finally speak. What she said was, "I don't have to worry about where i'm going to eat dinner tomorrow night anymore." Of course, if we had given up after an hour and a half of crying and just told her to knock it off, we might have had a very different outcome. Ironically, it seems like one of the behaviors many parents struggle with more than anything else is simple disrespect. When parents speak, they expect to be listened to, when they ask a question, they expect an answer, and they never, ever want to be told they're not even the real parent. But as you mentioned, normal healthy teenagers throw out disrespect like that all the time. Good parents can handle that, but if you adopt an older child, you might get nothing but disrespect for MONTHS AT A TIME. It wears parents down and they can't hold up their end of the bargain and love the child no matter what. If the parent stops showing love, the child feels vindicated like they were right all along, and it goes downhill from there. This kind of thing doesn't show up in a first visit, or a first week, or the first six months. "Honeymoon' is an inappropriate term because it makes it sound short. This kind of stuff can show up years later with a kid you thought had worked out their baggage. You're right, it seems like kids were a bad match for the parents, but that's only because the relationship has been going south for some time. Think of a couple that is in the middle of divorce - does it seem like it was even possible that they ever had anything in common? But, parenting kids is not like a marriage. You have to commit to your kids and love them and do your best whether they keep up their end of the bargain or not. You just have to keep on doing it no matter what. That can be really hard, and parents fail when they can't keep it up long enough or they can't figure out how to make their child feel safe. It's hard, but it's worth it. I wouldn't want our lives to have followed any other path.

I certainly understand that. My reading and questions are based off of a lot of peoples experiences not necessarily based off of this forum only. We started our training last weekend and I posed a similar question to the trainer. Her answer was similar to yours but she added another theory in which sometimes people just don't listen and tend to be blinded by love. They think that their love will be enough and the child they get will be "saved" by their love and their welcoming home and tend to ignore or forget what was said throughout the training. I think that theory makes a lot of sense. This exists not only through adoption, but more prevalently through adult relationships. Somebody is dating someone that has serious commitment issues or is into drugs or some other bad situation and that person either thinks that they can love the "bad" out of them, or they ignore it completely thinking it will go away. Only later down the road to wonder why that person is being so terrible to them, why they keep cheating on them, why they're spending all of their money on drugs, etc... I've seen this with my own sisters and their dating troubled men. The red flags were there, but they just didn't listen. The education from previous experience or from friends was there, but they didn't listen. It's one thing to go into these situations understanding the risks and potential issues and accepting they may happen, but you're doing it because you feel strongly about it, such as most adoptive parents feel. However, it's quite another to just ignore the potential issues, think your love will conquer all and heal that person completely or just hope it will go away with time. I really appreciate everyones input! This is extremely helpful. Some great stories here. chucklebelly, thank you for the inspiring story of your experience!

Yes, there is some truth to this theory, but I wouldn't call it "blinded by love" exactly. That may apply better in dating, but with your kids it's more that you get expectations for what they are going to become. It's true with natural born kids, too, every parent thinks their kid is going to grow up to be a doctor or win a Nobel prize, and when they don't there is disappointment to deal with. With adopting older kids, the disappointments come hard and fast and often very early in the process. Basically, things just don't turn out the way you thought they were going to. Sometimes it seems small, but it's not, like "I just want her to call me mom," or "Can't he just say he loves me when I've said it to him every night at bedtime for 2 years," or "Why can't I just remind her to clear her dishes without her blowing up at me?" Often, it's not so much that people want to "save" their older adopted kids, but just that they want them to be normal. It's hard knowing your kid hurts inside and will never really heal completely. The challenge is to make your expectations realistic, and genuinely be happy at the progress and healing that you you see in your child. When our oldest was placed at 14, we deliberately set 3 achievable goals in parenting her. (We never told her what they were!) They were: 1) Get her to graduate from high school, 2) Have her not be pregnant until after then, and 3) Make her laugh every day. She achieved so much more, but those goals helped us remember to keep things in perspective when she struggled and was difficult to parent.

Ok, this is what I'm terrified of. We already dealt with DSS investigating us once when they removed our FD right before she was due to RU. It was finally deemed "unfouned". Then a few months ago, another child (NOT foster child) makes false accusations against us, only this time it is deemed "founded". As we started the appeal process, thank God the child recanted to the police, but DSS refused to reinterview the child. So we are just flabbergasted how it only takes the child's say-so to mess our lives up for good, but even if they "take it back", they can't make it go away. How could we protect ourselves from this happening to us again? We've vowed never to babysit this child again, and frankly, we agreed to never be alone with another child, bc we are so paranoid that if this sweet child we've known for years could make up an elaborate lie like this, then any other child is just as likely to lie. And what's worst, DSS will believe a lying child when it's about this sort of abuse, no matter that there. is. no. abuse. We are treated as criminals simply bc a child told a nasty lie. It doesn't even matter that the child recanted. So how can we protect ourselves? Arrange to never be alone with our would-be adopted child until after finalization? But even then, they can lie if they don't like our rules (the motivating factor, as it turned out, for the child who lied about us). Sigh. I so would like to be able to really consider (ok, reconsider) adopting an older child, but then I am reminded of false accusations, and how there is nothing in place to protect the falsely accused, and I think - am I really willing to take on that level of drama? We've been able to dodge the bullet with this one (the police didn't file charges once child recanted, but DSS didn't follow suit, so we're still in the appeal process), but now we know that slander is as good as "fact" for DSS when it comes from a minor, so why, pray tell, would we want to do that to ourselves again? Sorry, I didn't mean to hijack the thread or be negative, I'm really trying to find out if there's something we COULD do to protect ourselves and therefore consider older child adoption after all.

I think the little blurb of info you get on the child is often wrong. For one of our kids, it was so far different from what she's like IRL that you wouldn't even guess it's the same kid. Different foster parents, different workers, things get confused or poorly translated to paper.

I advise lots and lots of research. None of the kids in foster care are there because they have had rosy lives. Especially the older ones. Research trauma in children and attachment issues. Some teens will be able to adjust quickly and will be fine, some will never be able to live in a family environment, most will be somewhere in the middle of those two. Sometimes social workers are wrong about things, sometimes they don't know about things and sometimes they out and out lie. If you find a child you are interested in you can submit your paperwork, but there may be other parents interested in that same child. There is a team who will look at all the parents interested in that child and choose the best match based on what is best for the child. Even if you are the only parents interested in a certain child they may say no because of reasons you don't know about. Perhaps they need to live closer to siblings for sibling visits, perhaps they have asked to stay in a school district, perhaps hey have special needs that you were not told about. Some parents do take the first child offered to them, but most of the time parents wanting to adopt have set out criteria they are looking for and will turn down children who are not in those parameters. Some behavior problems will not show up until the child has been in our home for months. Some will not show up till after finalization. Reading about some of these behavior problems is not the same as living with them. It's easy to say you can deal with them, but nothing is like living with them.

Hi! It's exciting that you're considering foster/adopting a teen (12-16 years old). I think you hear lots of negative stories about permanency for teens because it's an incredibly difficult experience for those teens to have to live through, never mind all that they've lived through to get to that place of needing a new/second family after being alive on the planet all those years. To my mind, the least of the issues is that they're teens (i.e., hormonal, going through all sorts of huge normal developmental changes, dealing with their impending young adulthood). The most salient issue, in my experience, is the tremendous loss they've suffered (in whatever form), which is *always* part of the experience for older foster/adopted children, and which very well may not surface in all its pain and ugliness until after finalization occurs. It's not that people haven't done their due diligence: it's just in the nature of healing through attaching, I believe. I would recommend keeping your heart and mind really open to what you learn in your training classes and what you hear from other foster/adoptive parents who have gone before you. There's good reason that you hear similar stories over and over, because no matter how well any family plans in advance, there's little that anyone can do to make the process of healing any faster or easier for the teen that you foster/adopt. And this is true for experienced parents as well---including myself. With hubris, I thought about my second foster/adoptive placement, "Oh, this second time will be easier: I've been through it already once, I know the issues, I have more and better resources lined up. I'm ready to go. Let the healing begin!" Ha! It doesn't work that way, I found. Maybe it's a tad bit smoother for my second daughter (who moved in at 12) than it was for my first daughter (who moved in at age 7, 10 years ago) because I'm experienced at raising children from the hurt places, but my newest daughter still has to walk every step of that journey, feel every pain, let go of the past, reach out towards the future, embrace permanency, just as my first daughter had to. And much of that process is/was necessarily on hold until she realized, deep in her core, that this---our home, our family---was the place, finally, where she could land and *start* to do all that painful, absorbing personal work. When that work starts is different for each child, but my guess is that, in general, the older the child, the longer it takes to reach the *starting* position for healing, even though, paradoxically, they have less of their childhood left. So, my gentle recommendation to you is to be prepared to have your world turned upside down, as you're standing alongside your child whose world has been turned upside down, one more time, by joining this first-ever permanent adoptive family. Be flexible, practice being patient and present, and be prepared to feel like a bumbling novice much of the time. Each child is unique, and each child is unknown, on many levels, upon entering a family, no matter how well everyone is doing their jobs. You will all change and grow in response to each other, and so, on some levels, you will be unknown to yourself as you go through the process. My best to you in your journey!