Unhealthy Attachment Issues (vent?)

Yikes, I would make the girl sit next to you at church, and talk with the CW about what grandmom is doing. Around here family knows that contact outside of supervised visits is prohibited, and trying to make contact could hinder their chances of getting the kids back.

Is Girl11 11 or some other age? Not sure if that is her age or your 11th girl. If she is 11, you have a harder battle because this behavior has been so engrained in her. Is she in therapy? First and foremost, you are the foster parent and outside of supervised visits by CPS, you are in control. I would put a cut to seeing grandma period. I would take her aside and say that you are trying to work on boundaries with girl11 and unfortunately, that means eliminating personal contact wtih even relatives until she understands. If Grandma cannot respect this, then you will not allow communication with her and girl11 outside of anything CPS allows. Unless I am missing a piece of the story.Let me tell you about Princess but she was younger so I am not sure that it will apply. She was almost 5.5 when she came to me. She had NO boundaries at all. It was the first thing EVERYONE noticed. I still think there was some SA there, but based on an incident we had that warranted an investigation, they deemed it unfounded. I will tell you, I don't trust those workers any more than I do the rest of the system. They did say that she could benefit from play therapy and even her counselor reported on so many things that pointed to SA. So, what we started with was every single day discussing appropriate and inappropriate touch. She was not allowed to hug or kiss anyone without first asking me. If I was not there, she had to ask her teacher. Then, she had to ask the person. Three or four months in, we were at my BFF's house. I am inside talking, loosely watching the kids play in the yard through the glass. Well, unbeknownst to me, one of niece's friends came over and this little girl looked just like a boy. Well, Princess started hanging all over her, kept calling her a boy, saying she wanted to marry "him" and so on. The girl and my niece came in and although the girl wasn't crying, she was visibly shaken up.That was last time Princess had no line of site while with me! I was flabborgasted. We went home and had the same conversation then discussed that sometimes boys and girls at that age do look like the other gender and made her think about how her actions affected that girl. This went on for a LONG time. It greatly affected my attachment to her. So finally, about a year in, she started showing and exhibiting age-appropriate boundaries. She didn't long to hug or kiss anyone. Then, wham-o, bio mom marries her 19yo BF and he starts coming to visits, dropping bio mom off, etc, he wasn't yet attached to the case. And it started all over again! Well, I discovered that bio mom was ENCOURAGING the behavior! She would tell the step-dad to pick up Princess. Mind you, by now she is 6.5, and quite tall, so even if it were a bio child, it would look awkward to see a father carrying a child like that.It was terrible. She would basically gyrate against him, latching her legs around his waist and nudging her bottom closer and closer down. I discovered this when I picked them up from a visit. NOT ONE SINGLE DA*N WORKER NOTED THIS!!!!! Not one!!! I had to bring it up with the CW who came same time as my worker. We had a long discussion about it. CW who was a young-fresh-out-college-20-something had never parented or even taken care of kids. She was like "what's the big deal." Had my worker not been there to back me up, I might have slapped the flipping CW! But, my worker backed me up and explained that with her history of boundary issues, and the fact that Princess barely knew this guy (bio mom met him 4 weeks before the girls were taken into care) it was totally inappropriate. CW supposedly talked to bio mom. Hah!Fast forward a few months, I am not knowing this is still going on, I took the girls to visit with their grandfather (bio mom's dad) who was visiting out of town. There was a light drizzle so bio mom and step dad came out to meet us. He picked up Princess and I flipped. I told him to put her down. He did not. I said "Put her down or we are leaving!"So then when we were leaving later, I saw it with my own two eyes, there is bio mom telling her hubby "pick up Princess, pick up your daughter," etc. I was steaming. I told Princess, you are almost 7 years old, you do not need picked up, you can walk.I found out soon before they left that she was encouraging inappropriate behavior at visits too. This is how I found out, Princess says to her NEW CW (the horrible one moved away) "CW, I don't understand, why does Step-Dad never want to pick Monkey up or have her sit on his lap." I was floored, I didn't know this lap sitting was going on. CW just raised her eye ands said that she didn't know.I use this all as an example because if the agency wasn't going to back up the plan on teaching her appropriateness, it was a losing battle. Truth is, she knew better wtih strangers, but I don't know how much of that "stuck" with her when she RU. I'll further add, this is one of the biggest reasons why I think bio mom cut me off. I sent a letter to the magistrate (big mistake!) because GAL was off traveling Europe and not responding to emails and bio mom's new attorney was asking to return the girls to her, even though unsupervised visits had not begun! So I detailed all of these issues, along with a few other things, and basically implied that her husband was inappropriate at best, a pedophile at worse, and bio mom saw that letter. Sorry, I guess I vented a bit there, but you need to ensure that the workers are onboard with your plan and will follow through. I have no doubt that Princess probably lost a lot of what i taught her when she RU. And pedophiles know how to pick these kind of children. Sadly, bio mom is now divorcing the yucky step-dad, and I say sadly because she is now shacking up with a guy she met 6 weeks ago, with MY GIRLS!!!, and I saw his picture, he looks as creepy as step-dad, and he is a whole 19 years old! She is now 29. I worry so much for Princess. And I wish I would have taken the behaviors at visits up the chain at CPS so that it would have all been on record and I didn't need to write that letter. (The old CW, who was the CW for the first 21 months, wasn't documenting anything that went against RU! Not even reports from the parent mentor about challenges or advice from the counselor that Princess was exhibiting signs of SA.)Good luck to you! THis is going to be a hard battle. I saw how hard it was with Princess at 6, I can't imagine dealing with an 11 yo. one thing you have, she should have better cognitive learning now than a 6yo would so you can use more positive/negative reinforcement.Oh, i forgot, I would also build the properness teaching into our life. So, it would be nonchallant. If we were out and I saw something inappropriate, I would just comment "wow, that doesn't look very nice." Or like modeling, her bio mom had her modeling all of these provocative poses on her myspace page, and Princess would do it here too. We would watch REAL models and see how they walked the runway and I would teach her that they did not strike poses showing off their female parts!

The PP is dead on in a lot of areas. This is going to be an uphill battle if this girl is 11. She needs to sit with you at church or you need to go to a different church. I also completely agree about the no kissing on the mouth. I'm one of those weird people who doesn't kiss their children on the mouth. I find it inappropriate. I think kissing a cheek, a forehead, etc. is better. I also think, if she isn't already, Girl11 needs to be in an aggressive therapy, probably twice a week. Things like taking her underwear off need to result in immediate discipline and she should be able to dress inappropriately because you are in charge of her clothing. Modest only. Knee length shorts, knee length skirts or longer dresser only.

I didn't know you could pass herpes, the cold sore version, to your child when you don't have an outbreak! I pray I didn't give it to Chubbs, although, he could have it from bio mom. I likely got it as a child from my own family. Great point with the clothing! I forgot I had to address that too. In cooler weather, tights might be a good addition. I think an 11yo removing her panties is way above normal.

You definitely need to limit contact with that bio family. Does your church have a different service that you can go to like the morning one instead of a later one? Or is there another church that you can start going to temporarily at least? As for the child I definitely think she needs a change in clothing. No dresses, no skirts, no short shorts, Maybe even a different kind of underwear (like the boy shorts they call them, to cover more). I would not let her out of your sight when there's other kids around. You don't want something happening. I would discuss personal space as a larger area for her, and teach her not to get within an arms reach or more of others. It's probably too easy for her to get back into her old routine if she's given a chance to get close to someone. And counseling for sure. Not just any counseling either. Look for one specific to the issues.Good luck!

If your church doesn't have a different service or another nearby, maybe you could try coming in later and sitting somewhere away from grandma and of course requiring her to sit with you. Clothes, you can control. Inappropriate clothing can disappear. If the child is foster with a goal of RU, you can just put the inappropriate clothing away for then. Unless required by your religion, I would take away dresses for now, since she is removing underwear and tights. Maybe leggins would be a better bet. If dresses are required just for church, then I would take them away and give her one each week for church (one that is appropriate and give her leggings) Do lots of documenting, as it will help to get her help later. She will need line of sight supervision.

This is how our FD8 is. We recently switched her to a therapist who deals with traumatized children. (She's been in therapy since she was 4.) She been seeing the new one since February. We are not seeing much progress & the behavior is getting worse. At her previous foster home she would sneak inappropriate clothing to school, show her underwear when wearing skirts/dresses, etc. Here she doesn't have any inappropriate clothing or skirts or dresses, so it hasn't been an issue. We're at the point where we just don't let FD8 out of our site. She stays right by us when we are out in public, so she misses out on a lot of fun/running around, but until she can be trusted, it's in her best interests.

Thanks everyone. Yes girl is 11 years old. The incident with her taking her leggings and underware off was before she came into my home. But I heard about it because another family at our church was taking her to and from AWANA's classes and they witnessed that, thought I needed to know once girl11 came to live with us. I certainly control what she wears! Since I've pretty much had to buy all new stuff...she came with a wadded up hand full of too small..2 pair of shorts and maybe 3 shirts...3 pair of socks and maybe 3 pair of panties. I had to go that very night and get her underware and tank tops. I make her wear a tank top under everything and legging under all skirts and dresses. No shorts above the knee. She is not placed here by CPS. I found out she was living with grandmom with no power and asked mom if she was willing to let girl11 come stay with us until she got things together. At first I was thinking a couple days maybe a week. That was a month and half ago. We are suppose to go this coming week to the courthouse to file transfer of custody papers (if mom shows up!!! she's not be exactly reliable). I found out about the family history and the SA from CPS they said they were going to file a petition in court to take girl11 from mom but 3 weeks later they still had not. So I asked if we transfer custody will they back off and since they have not filed anything in court they said they would. (YAY!! because I am not impressed with the way they run things and would much rather be in charge of girl11's care rather than always waiting on them) Mom did tell me about the SA but she totally sugar coated it made it sound like a 1 time no big deal event. The social worker for the older brother had quite another way more serious story to tell me. So mom is kinda in denial about it all or something (??) Girl is in counseling I take her once per week to one counselor and twice per month to another....since I have no legal authority over her yet they can't discuss anything with me..I'm just a taxi....hopefully that will change this week and I can maybe make my own appt with each of them to discuss things I've been witnessing and see what their approach with her is and / or any recommendations they have for things they know I may not. And grandmom....????? that woman...???? I totally don't get....and she certainly instigates the very poor boundaries and she purposely eggs on girl's bad behavior in my presence. Telling her she's coming home soon and I'm just over reacting and she's grandmother so what I say doesn't matter. I do make girl11 sit near me and I do tell them both to stop but after I say something it seems grandmom will then go out of her way to make sure it happens again and again...bah!!! and I've been trying not to make a scene in church but I tell you it's coming...and Jesus will just have to forgive me.... next week I think we're putting girl11 sitting between my husband and I...currently she's been sitting in the seat right in front of me..but we'll see how this new plan may work.

Can you enlist the pastor into setting boundaries during services and having a talk with grandma?

If you have to take a break from that particular church you must. Believe me, as a church goer myself that's not easy to even suggest. However, it's not a safe environment for her right now. She is having a week's worth of progress reduced every Sunday that she sees that woman.I hope for both your sakes you are able to get full legal custody. I really do. I hope this means bio mom will have no more rights and it's irrevocable. Does your state have Grandparent Rights? I surely hope not.

I haven't had a situation with a foster child, but we do frequently babysit a 6yr old girl who has no concept of personal space. we had to show her that you hold out your arms and don't go any closer than that. that seems to have helped some. typically she will be completely and literally in your face( even when coughing) at all times. she wants to hug and kiss everyone she knows. Mother thinks its cute-mind you she kisses them with tongue and runs around naked in front of all her children.:mad:

we went and file papers at the courthouse today!! :-)!!!!!! I'm suppose to hear from the judge within a week if he'll just order/sign them since it's not contested or if he wants to schedule a hearing. Lady in office said even if we go back and forth a couple times with the judge and have a hearing with it not being contested we could potentially have full custody within 30 days :-) Already much faster than CPS has been moving!! When we have signed papers from the judge that she is my responsibility I will have much more boldness in dealing with grandmom...currently I try not to rock the boat too much because they can just come pick her up at anytime. I ask her politely to not do this or that.. but when I have authority to actually tell grandmom hey that's enough and if you can't respect my rules then you can't see her it will hopefully greatly improve. I'm a church leader, Sunday school teacher, been a member for almost 10 years.....if grandmom doesn't start respecting my rules with girl11 I will ask the church board to step in and address her. She's not a member doesn't attend regularly (even less now that the church as cut her off financially).....so We'll try having girl11 sit between us a couple more Sunday's and then when I get the papers we'll have a thorough discussion with grandmom about how it's going to be now. I'm not sure about our state and grandparent rights...but even if she tried to claim them...any sort of investigation of her ....she has no hope....no income no stable home drug addicted hoarder....you can barely walk into her house. I'm 5'5 ish and stuff is piled up EVERY where up to my shoulders..they haven't had any power or running water for over a month ...thus what original brought girl11 to my home I found out about it and said girl can come stay with me or we can call CPS. Mom said ok and she was trying to get her own apartment....but mom hasn't been trying this past month and she signed the papers today uncontested we can have custody. She didn't agree to relinquish her parental rights but to get custody back she'd have to come up with the 400.00 to file the petition and show proof she can take care of girl11...I'll have the right to contest before the judge...I really don't think it will come to all that though....I honestly think mom is glad to not have the responsibility. She's already lost 2 other children.

I hear you. I'm a Young Women's leader and church is very important to me. I'm glad to hear if papers are signed you'll feel more comfortable speaking to her. She sounds really, really inappropriate and remember, women can be molesters too. Eww. Hopefully this all gets wrapped up and you can continue to help Girl11 heal!