I need someone to listen to me.....

Brandy I can totally see where your point is but the money that exchanged hands was not for our BS but for us to move, the $2200.00 was paid back over time and he has gotten the entire amount back. I just thought it to be odd that he only offered to help us while asking for our son. Thats the only reason I ever mentioned it. Also I never mentioned anything about trying to regain custody as that is not something I would ever do, I am just looking to access sealed records as we do not know what his reasoning for wanting our son was.

Are you saying that you and yours had no place to live, so you agreed to 'give' your son to your brother-in-law in exchange for a place to live? Then you signed papers you didn't understand which allowed your brother-in-law to adopt this child? And then you lost some of the paperwork? This is just me, ok? Its hard for me to paint your brother-in-law as the villain here. On the other hand, it will be up to a judge to determine if there was coercion, as opposed to a great amount of assistance and concern for the child and his environment.

Actually no we did have a place to live, and the papers signed we knew were for consent to adopt our son but what we didn't know is that we were waiving our right to appear in court.

What a creep. Preying on a family in need and basically buying a baby IMO. This child will be so upset to know how he was aquired in a sleezy manner,IMO.

He really didn't buy a baby due to the money recieved was paid back. Others seen it that way for a long time until I had a consultation with an attorney 3 days ago. When I filed for access to records I had to attach all reciepts for the payments we made as well.

We were evicted, and had no place to go. We wound up moving in with my mother, where the conditions weren't exactly suitable for a family of 8 added to the people already living there. AF offered us a home for BS until we could get a place of our ownӔ

Once BS was temporarily residing with him, he called and offered to buy us a home, or to pay for us to get established in a place, if we would allow him to adopt BS.

After living with my mother for more than a month, it became clear that the only way we would be able to get a place of our own was with help from Jon.Ӕ Assuming Jon is AF, it appears otherwise. Maybe you mis-spoke in the statements above. I don't know about that. I'm also not saying that Jon is a saint. He looks complicit as well. You two exchanged money (whether you later paid it back or not) with the child as the object of trade. I'm with Brandy on this one. I wish you good luck, but honestly, it is the child I'm concerned about. He didn't do anything wrong and he's the one who will ultimately suffer regardless of the outcome.

Im sure IҒm not going to be very popular either, but you asked for input from birthmothers so here my 2 cents worth.... Why do you think AF's reasons for wanting to adopt your son will be in the sealed records? I can understand you wanting to know this, but IMHO I donҒt think these answers are going to be found in the court records. Shouldnt you have asked AF that question the very first time he said he wanted the son, you know right from the start? You mention in another post that you wanted to be heard in court to give your "side of the situation", why do you think this would have impacted the adoption? Would it have stopped it? If not, than what's the difference? Do you really believe that you being in the court room would have changed the "agreement" (i.e. given you visitation) I personally think the only way you would have legally gotten visitation "rights" was to have it interwoven into the adoption agreement...or whatever papers you signed. And even then I think ғmandated or agreed to visitations are terribly hard to get enforced by the legal community. IMHO: I don't think ignorance of your rights entitles you to anything, especially years later (not even sealed court records) and that you were not "unjustly denied" anything. You can't just walk around claiming "I didn't know", you should have at least read and understood what you were signing, if you didn't you shouldn't have signed it without consulting an attorney...you were obviously aware that it was adoption related, you were okay with leaving your son in AF's care, and you were also okay with receiving money for it (whether it was paid back or not) I hope you and your family find a way to heal from all this and that your focus turns away from wanting your day in court to the child, who ultimately be the one the pay for everyoneԒs mistakes.

Mrs. Hoot, I was going to make the same exact point about "what difference would have being in court have made?" To Hating, I don't think there will be any way (even if you could establish "coercion") that you can "undo" what happened or "force" visitation. I don't know what your state's laws are, but in ours, once an adoption is finalized, there is sort of no "undoing" it (even in cases of claimed coercion or duress). That doesn't mean you shouldn't consult a lawyer who may be able to help you in whatever it is you are looking for. Since this sounds like a family adoption, maybe you could ask a parents for a "sitdown" or "mediation" where you could explain to them what you want (without going thru all of these legal mechanisms that probably are only going to serve to alienate them, and ultimately your child, from you). Just my two cents. I am sorry you are hurting so.

I am sorry this is all so hurtful to you. I saw the statute you listed, and I understand you feel you were coeced or under duress to arrive at this point. At least that is what I read from your post. My son was adopted in-family also - totally not by my wishes, but rather by my parents because I was 17 at the time. I contested the adoption once I turned 18 (about a month later). My attorney tried to cite duress as the reasoning for adoption occuring. This was not allowed to be duress of circumstances. In my situation, that did not matter, and the adoption stood. It seems unfair that family members can be so mean and self-serving, but unfortunately, they can be. My prayers are with you, this does not seem like an easily resolvable situation you are facing.

First off I guess I better make it clear that I have not nor will ever petition the court for visitation as I know that is not possible. What I meant by and should of made clearer when posting is that the AP's made alot of promises and they should be followed through with. I now know that there should of been a Post Adoption Agreement but there was not. As for me speaking with an attorney at the time of adoption we were not financially able to do so and if we had our day in court then we would of had an attorney appointed to us. As for signing a paper and not knowing what it was....the paper clearly stated what it was for. Consent to Adopt, we were aware of that. We should have signed a Judicial Consent meaning we could appear in court but we signed a Extra-Judicial Consent not knowing our rights to go to court we waived. As for wanting to know the reasons, yes I should of thought to ask at the time but thats just another mistake made by me. What do I think I will find in the sealed records? Not alot but would like to know what they put as to this question: 6. The manner in which the adoptive parent(s) obtained the adoptive child is as follows: As I said before did they say we were bad parents, did they say we just simply didn't want our BS....I don't know what was said and it really shouldn't matter to me I guess. As for mediation, we tried getting the AP's to do so but they refused. Why wait 2 yrs to go ahead with anything, because all the promises made have not been followed through with. I can accept what the AP's are doing, my children, BS's siblings do not understand why they don't get to see their brother and why their Uncle won't allow them to. None of us know what his reasoning is and when he heard I was going to try to gain access to sealed records he called me threatening me that if I did then I'de be sorry. I told him if he done everything the way it should of been then why not be civil about all of this, he got very aggitated and started cursing and said my world would come apart if I follow through. He can do what he wants to me but all of the children have suffered enough why make them suffer anymore. Seems as if he got what he wanted and then just forgot BS had siblings. As I said before I would never do anything to hurt BS or the AP's, they are very good parents to our BS, he will never be without nor ever want for anything. They do a great job!! As for BS finding out this or that when he is older, I have no intentions on telling him anything. That is the AP's place to do so. The only thing I do worry about...is BS going to wonder why he was able to be a part of his siblings life for 3 yrs and then all of a sudden for unknown reasons he could no longer see them?

Actually, no. You only have a right to have counsel appointed in criminal cases. The state is not required to appoint counsel unless a person's liberty is at stake. You could have appeared on your own behalf (pro se) or applied to have Legal Aid or a similar type organization which takes on cases either for free (pro bono) or at a reduced cost, but you don't have any constitutional right to counsel unless you've been accused of a crime which, without the assistance of effective counsel, could result in a you being deprived of your own liberty (i.e. jail time.)

THE PARENT HAS THE RIGHT TO LEGAL REPRESENTATION OF THE PARENT'S OWN CHOOSING, THE RIGHT TO SUPPORTIVE COUNSELING AND MAY HAVE THE RIGHT TO HAVE THE COURT APPOINT AN ATTORNEY. The above is what the Extra-Judicail Consent form stated. When such person first appears in court, the surrogate shall advise such person before proceeding that he has the right to be represented by counsel of his own choosing, of his right to have an adjournment to confer with counsel, and of his right to have counsel assigned by the court in any case where he is financially unable to obtain the same; Above is from the Surrogates Court web site in the county the proceedings took place.

I'm sorry I really can't see what benift there is in obtaining court records that will only tell you what the court was told, which is not necessarily the truth anyway. But be prepared, as much as you tell yourself it's the AP's responsibility to tell the child about all this...one day that child will be an adult and may look to you for answers, too.

You know your right MrsHoot, I will gain absolutely nothing from seeing those sealed files, I'm sure what I'de see would probably just cause alot more pain for me(ex: AP stating we didn't want him, bad parent and so on). I ask myself why did I even start this thread, well now that I have and have responses my thoughts on seeing those records are totally different now! As for when he is older and if he does decide to come to us for answers, thats not something I want to think about either. What if AP's aren't totally honest with him and we tell him something he doesn't already know. I have many years before that is to come but it is still thought about alot. So for now 2 yrs after he has been adopted I so think I am going to see a doc, maybe he/she can help me out with all the anxiety and such. At this time I am not going to sit and think about what has happened and live in the past. I've gotta look into the future and do all that is best for the little ones I have here :)! We all know what has happened and BS is very happy with his AP's, they treat him well and maybe someday things will be different (just hoping its not 15 yrs from now). BTW for any of the BM's or adoptees....what do you think BS remembers if anything considering he was adopted at 13 months?

I know you don't want to think about it now but I think it's better to make peace with yourself now, rather than caught off guard - frozen in the headlights like a deer...and they probably won't tell the same story you do - how could they, we all have our own truths...our own side to every story, and every side is different, isn't it? I think it's probably a good idea to see a doctor (or a good counselor) and you may even want to start journaling your journey...it may help you down the road when time blurs our memories...because, as much as I hate to say it, it could be at least 15 years. As for how much he’ll remember, I guess that all depends on how old is...at 4 probably some, at 14 much less, at 24 probably not much...now that’s just been my experience, I know the daughters I’m raising don’t remember much, other than bits and pieces of their lives prior to age 5...I know it’s not what you want to hear, but that’s just my experience. Much luck on your path to healing!