Hey...Wanna Buy a Baby?

I can see that this thread is going the way all the reform threads eventually go....down south. I'm having trouble even thinking of anything that will add to the conversation in a rational, positive manner without offending some adoptive parents. Crick, you make some excellent points. As far as birth/first mothers working on behalf of adoption reform and open records, many of us have been there, done that. I've been speaking publicly as an activist for over 30 years now. I'm still a consultant for the adoption agency I relinquished through back in 1972, and they've listened to much of what I have to say for many years now. I've testified before legislative bodies, written articles for various newspapers, and worked closely with adoptees in the fight to gain access to their original birth certificates. And, YES, we've made a difference in the past 30 years...a huge difference. But up until recently, it's pretty much been adoptees and birth moms who've taken up the cause of adoption reform and open records. I'm not bothered at all if adoptive parents don't want to join us in trying to ensure that pregnant women are treated fairly and ethically by agencies, lawyers, and facilitators. But for pete's sake, please join us in fighting for adoptee rights. Your children are adoptees...and one day will be adults who will have to obtain passports and drivers' licenses, adults who one day may feel curious about their origins and want to know more about the women who gave them life. Like Beth, I got a lot of flack in reform circles when I joined these forums. But I believed then, just as I do now, that we NEED to build a bridge between all three sides of the triad. I'm just not sure how to go about doing that anymore....

After 27 years as a fairly public birthmom I can definitely say I have been demonized. You would not believe the things people have said to me. Not all, but enough that instilled negative beliefs about myself. The "selfless, angel" crap was jut as damaging. The bottom line is that it is so much more complicated than either one of those stereotypes.

After 27 years as a fairly public birthmom I can definitely say I have been demonized. You would not believe the things people have said to me. Not all, but enough that instilled negative beliefs about myself. The "selfless, angel" crap was jut as damaging. The bottom line is that it is so much more complicated than either one of those stereotypes.

I know I started an "adoption reform" thread about 2 years ago, and out of 13 pages, there were only a sad few participants from start to finish...but at least those participants were willing to have a respectful dialogue...and at least they WANTED to make a change. It seemed to be a pretty good discussion - not like the back and forth finger pointing cr*p I see going on here half the time. The problem is, there are so many people on these boards that have a personal issue with one another that when person A comes to a thread like this to give a point of view, person B (or C, D, E) makes ASSUMPTIONS that the POV is somehow sinister or slighting when it very well may NOT be. If anyone cares to see how "far" we got in the reform discussion (look at page 7 for the list we came up with and REMEMBER it WAS 2 years ago, so please...) here it is: [url]http://forums.adoption.com/general-adoptive-parent-support/368712-adoption-reform.html[/url]

Going back to the original point of this thread, I applaud ErinandWill's refusal to participate in an "icky" arrangement. I'm sure the temptation was strong and I was glad to see a PAP refusing on ethical grounds. Hope everything works out, ErinandWill.

I'm sorry Caths. I was reading several threads last night and got distracted by a phone call so I may have responded on the wrong thread. I'm tired and also on a.com overload! lolI completely understand your response and I do understand why you feel the way you feel. :)

Well, I guess that makes me feel a little less old. . .. ;) It's hard to believe the changes that have come in just 20-30 years, isn't it? I think there's a lot to be said for that approach.

Hi Beth-- Has there been a thread or two over on the adoptee side about this subject? I've often wondered how adult adoptees feel about it, especially after seeing how it works from an adult perspective. Wow. Just. . ..wow.

First of all the credentials and the disclaimers: I am a birthmom in a fully open adoption. My son is 27. I am a therapist; a clinical social worker that specializes in adoption and trauma/loss. I have educated others about open adoption/adoption reform for over 24 years. I recently presented a number of trainings for the Infant Adoption Awareness project through the Arizona Children's Home on pregnancy counseling. Here is my take on it. Women (and men) in a crisis pregnancy are just that... in crisis. There are specific protocols for crisis interventions, and except for a handful of agencies, no one uses these interventions in pregnancy counseling.The bottom line is that the neurophysiology of a person in crisis is vastly different that someone who is not. It effects decision making and the ability to retain and process information. There is a great amount of physiological dysregulation that impacts mood, emotion and self-esteem. Crisis intervention needs to be the first approach in pregnancy counseling. Anything less will not provide those in crisis pregnancies what they need.

Raven - I know how much work has gone into reform and how much of it has been done by first moms & adoptees. My point on aparents being expected to do their part (and we should) is simply that on many threads it turns into "Well, nothing will change because those evil aparents won't do their jobs". That isn't going to do anything positive. Just here on this thread alone several have come right out and said they blame aparents for lack of ethics in adoption. Huh. As it's been said so many times on here and everywhere it goes all ways but most on this thread have only been interested in the blame game. (and again, that's on all sides) There's just a few members who, for whatever reason, are always intent on playing that stupid game of blame, snide, and attacks. Maybe it's just time to ban them because they certainly don't add anything positive. Hmm...

From my observations, adopting through foster can be very difficult simply because the system often favors a bioligical family member for placement. So, I've seen it where members of my family have fostered a sibling group for over a year, done so much work with the kids to improve their behavior, gotten totally attached to them in hopes of adopting, and then they are returned to their mother. It's almost more heartbreaking for them than a "failed adoption" was because they got so attached. God bless their hearts because they are fostering another child they hope to adopt. It takes extremely special people to do what they do. Hats off to foster parents!

Well I haven't really visited and definitely not posted here in MONTHS for this very reason! All this time I've been gone and nothing has changed. It's the same people and the crap. So Crick why not just ban them all?? Thats AP, BP and Adoptees that are here to only stir the pot. BTW to put rumors to rest i am not nor was I ever banned. I left because of the same toxic vibe I felt here. Obviously its not just me since I've been gone all this time and yet nothing has changed. Listen I've adopted my son and have a great relationship with his bmom so I'm ok but I worry about newbies coming here looking for support and all they get is whos blames who! What happended to the place I joined for support 4 yrs ago? I know if I came now I would run a way. So yes ban them all and lets get back to ADOPTION SUPPORT! It's 2012 a new year lets move forward or move on! Sorry but I think post was worth me coming out of MY self imposed exile! Thank you for listening!

Well, I for one am glad to see you around Supa!

HA! I do this all the time! Funny thing is, most people don't even realize I'm gone, LOL! And yes, history seems to repeat itself... When I read the first line of that thread I started two years ago, it basically asks that people please put aside the differences and come together respectfully. Hope springs eternal, I guess. :arrow:

Seems like a good place to end this thread and start anew.:fish: 2012 Ethics & Reform, here we come...:cheer: