Advertisements
Hi, I am new here. My husband and I have been trying for 2 years now to adopt through the state of WA (dshs). We have two bio daughters ages 8 and 9.
We have just been chosen to adopt 3 sisters from Oregon. They are 5, 9, and 11. Every time we talk about adopting the 3 girls (except my family) people always say, "WHAT? Are you crazy, you really need to think about this, 5 is way too many." Everyone my husband talks to (mostly other men that he works with) say that it will be bad for our relationship, that it will take away from our two daughters, we will always be struggling with money, that we never will be able to go places. I think it is a bunch of crock, yes we will have to budget diffferent, we will have to balance the attention of the girls, we will have to be more resourceful for vacations but nothing that will be too major.
To me, I see it as gaining 3 more beautiful daughters. Yes, I know with older children, you have a lot of "thorns" that go along with the "flowers" but that is part of adopting older children. I know that yes, my two daughters now will not be able to have as much as before, but do they really need to get everything they want, if it is not really that important? I realize that, it is going to be a lot more chaotic when we go places. We had our first visit with them this weekend, and some places it was a bit difficult but when you have children that have never had "you need to stay with us, don't run in the parking lot, you cannot just go off without an adult" that is to be expected, it will get better later right, once you teach them boundries?
My question is, how big is too big for a family? Can any of you BIG adopted families help with advice, pro's and con's? How do you handle transtitioning of bio and adopted children wanting your undivided attention? My husband was a little overwhelm because the 3 girls were fighting over my husbands attention (their real dad was always leaving for long periods of time, then reappearing, just to disappear again) at times he felt that he was not giving enough attention to our girls.
My husband is just now rethinking, he is afraid now that maybe "5" girls is too many, since he is never hearing anything positive about this. The girls are coming up next week for their 2nd visit with us, we will have them for 5 days. We are waiting for WA approval to mentor for Oregon until they can actually come live with us. (which is frustratingly long)
I told my husband that he needs to give it more then the first visit, and to go with what he feels, not what others feel. His biggest problem is, he (we both) feel completely in love with the youngest and we know that we will with the oldest too. The middle girl (9) is a struggle, she shows little emotion, and when she doesn't want to do something, she shuts down completely, like a statue. My husband is afraid that he might not be able to "love" her like the other two or our daughters. I told him that, in time that might change. That this weekend was a huge thing to them, not only that, the DSHS office decided to have the "goodbye" meeting with their mom two days before we officially met the girls. They were told that this was the last time they would see or talk to their mom. So I am sure that had a lot to do with the middle girl but I know from reading the case file that she does just "shut down" when she doesn't want to do something. So it is something that we will have to work with. Which I can handle, my husband is not so sure. He is struggling cause he doesn't know what to do. He just doesn't know if this is the right thing now.
ANY ADVICE please!!!! Sorry so long and kind of scattered.
Like
Share
lizzieisfullofhope
If anything Chey is excited about having a "sister who will be like a twin" and the two actually were together most of the weekend. .
Advertisements
I am just wondering, has anyone out there adopted older children that turned out okay? It seems like everyone is saying, no, that something horrible is going to happen. Has it ever turned out okay? I know that it will be long road but are all older adopted children going to turn out "bad"?
There has to be kids that turned out okay or am I just hoping?
I really appreciate all of the words of wisdom and experience, I really do. It really helps us to really think about everything and anything that could go wrong.
None of my kids are rotten. However, they brought with them the trauma of abuse and the permanant damage from chronic neglect. These kids have not really had childhoods. Instead of playing and learning to love and trust, they have been working hard on the skills of survival. And much of what they had to do to survive, does not transfer well into a healthy family.
They need therapy to address the trauma and theraputic parenting and often regression and reparenting to hopefully pick up pieces they've missed along the way.
Can they become healthy? Yes, if they want to work on it. But I do not believe you can bring older children into a home with other children without the high risk of causing problems to the healthy kids. This is especially true of children close in age.
I advise only bringing children younger then your own into the home.
I did bring an older child into my home(though all my kids are from trauma backgrounds). I loved this boy and he was a lot of fun. But he taught my other boys things they didn't need to know. (beyond normal older brother stuff)
Lizzie - I hate to join the band wagon. My question is have you ever been a foster parent? The only reason I ask this is because had I not fostered first I wouldn't of known what age child works for our house. You never really know what your getting yourself into, until your in it. Even having family members experiencing children from the system or teaching or counseling, nothing and I mean nothing will prepare you for these children.
I have a bson who is 8 and he was on board for the whole process and even when they called me with the boys I asked him first, on how he felt and he was trully excited to have a fbrother 6 months younger than him. He said they would be friends etc... it lasted about a week. Things got a lot worse before they got better. I don't think that I could adopt my fson, other than the fact he has major issues (thankfully under control right now), I don't think it's fair to my son. We make a point of making sure we treat all the kids the same and spend time with them individually but I have seen some jealousy and bad behavior out of my son, which I think I would have never seen if my fson was younger. On the other hand, the boys were at each others throats for a while and are coming around slowly. It's a relationship that has to develop. No-one person with birth siblings can honestly say that they weren't jealous of their siblings at one pointe or another, it happens with birth, adoptive and foster families.
Most importantly your dh has to be on board 150% if he's not, you will find that after the kids are in your home permantely that it will drive a wedge in your marriage and lives. And he/you/bios/adopted will resent (sp?) each other.
Find out some more on these kids.
Ultimately, its a decision that you and your dh has to make. I too would suggest speaking to your pastor or counselor to express eachothers concerns in front of a non-partisan person.
I don't think any of us want to discourage you from adopting an older child. It can be a very rewarding relationship, it will be very different than the relationship you have now with your girls. What I am concerned about is your particular situation, these kids from your description, are coming from a very chaotic childhood. They will repeat this in your home, they will find ways to make your home chaotic. Your DH has concerns and you still think you can balance the love and attention you will give each child. That will not happen, the new children will get ALL of your attention and your girls will have their lives overturned and question your love for them. Your family can over come all of this, it will be hard and it will be impossible if your DH doesn't want it badly. All we have to go on is your description and perhaps we have misunderstood some details but with the situation you have explained it seems like your DH has good reason for concern.
Advertisements
Lizzie:Many people have adopted older children that turned out OK. I do believe that all older child adoptions still have issues. It’s just to varying degrees. That does not make it an unsuccessful adoption.Remember that these children will not be like your biological children in all likelihood. Their lives have been very different, their experiences have been different. They will probably be very immature for their age in some ways and very mature in others. My children had problems with this with their adopted sister.I have two biological children and I would not adopt and disrupt their order. This is for several reasons. One being that they are entrenched in their positions. My children asked me not to adopt a child older than them and I honored that. Second, you just don't know what the new children will be like. Yes, most of the time everything is fine. But, I personally would not take that chance. Children from foster care have been exposed to things that our biological children have not. They may not know certain rules. They may not have good boundaries. You are right that the majority of the time everything is fine. But, I would not chance it. Lastly, a new child takes a lot of time away from you and your children. While that is true with children of any age, I know my children were more accepting of a younger child taking my time.With my adopted daughter, I would not worry about birth order if I adopted again. She does not have an entrenched position in our family, I believe due to the fact that she was moved from family to family and was in a different birth order all the time. Also, she just doesn't have a general sense of family. So, I would disrupt the order with her, but not with my biological children.I would not be concerned about bringing these girls into the family if it were not for the fact of your other children's ages. So, in answer to your question - yes, there are plenty of adoptions where things turned out OK (and remember - OK is relative, what I consider OK, you may not and vice versa). You must search your heart and determine what is best for you. No one is saying don’t do it, just be cautious. Many of us have seen the chaos these children can bring to your family (and by chaos, I don’t mean noise, I mean havoc). And we just want you to be sure it’s the best for everyone in your family.Good luck to you.Lorraine
lizzieisfullofhope
I am just wondering, has anyone out there adopted older children that turned out okay? It seems like everyone is saying, no, that something horrible is going to happen. Has it ever turned out okay? I know that it will be long road but are all older adopted children going to turn out "bad"?
There has to be kids that turned out okay or am I just hoping?
I really appreciate all of the words of wisdom and experience, I really do. It really helps us to really think about everything and anything that could go wrong.
The middle dd is causing me to see red flags...her shutting down will likely take years beyond years to overcome...and also you said your bio's come first....BUT if you adopt, they will come LAST...the sheer overwhelming needs of the 3 will devour all your time energy and capacity...even if they aren't trying to do that on purpose. Later, after several years, you may find the balance again, but not at first...and last of all..."seeing" a behavior is much much different than living with it day in and day out 24-7. I was drained after less than a week of living with my dd...and she wasn't abused or even neglected much, she wasn't in foster care, and she was only 3.5 yrs old. I was a total Zombie for over a year because of how draining it was...and I only had HER, no other children or demands on my time.I'm also not the sort of person to shy away from a challenge, and no one who knows me could have predicted I'd be emotionally empty EVER, let alone just after a week. I'm even from a family of 7 kids, so chaos is 2nd nature to me.My dd is 7 now, and she requires about twice as much effort as any of the other kids her age....which is a big improvement over the 100 tiems more effort she started out needing. Also, "once they learn the boundaries" is somewhat of a false statement. No boundaries exist for my daughter.....unles SHE puts them in place herself. It is the thing I struggle with the most...she never had them before, and trying to impose them NOW is insanely hard to do.They're right, your entire lifestyle will change. How and what you do will be dramatically altered, and you won't even recognize your life...doesn't mean you won't like it or love it, but it won't feel like your life anymore.And as far as "happy endings" go...yes, there are some, but the scars of their childhoods remain...and affect them for the rest of their lives. Someone who goes blind, can live a happy fulfilled life, but the blindness is something they will always have to take into consideration and work around. Same with adopting older children....and children learn by example, so even if your daughters don't pick up the mannerisms and "tools" of the other 3, it will still hurt them to see you endure emotional abuse at the hands of their siblings...
Advertisements
:D Adoption Ally is now putting out her psycho-quack sign:
Lizzie - you seem to want someone to tell you that this will work, and everything will be OK in the end.
None of us can do that. NOBODY can do that. Not because we wouldn't want to; it's because you're dealing with human beings, some who have been very damaged. It's impossible to say that it will turn out just fine.
Maybe it will. It does happen.
But here is a summary of what everyone is trying to tell you:
Under the best of circumstances, adopting a sibling group is incredibly challenging, and takes enormous resources and imparts a significant impact on your life.
Adopting older children is incredibly challenging, and takes enourmous resources and imparts a significant impact on your life.
Adopting a sibling group is tough when you have bio children.
Adoptiong a sibling group that is larger than the number of bio kids you have is very tough on the bio kids.
Adopting out of birth order generally has a big NEGATIVE impact on bio children.
Adopting a sibling group when two out of the three are the same age or older than your bio kids is even harder on bio kids.
Few, if any, AP's who have adopted kids older than their bio children would recommend doing it - as a matter of fact they think it's a REALLY bad idea.
At least one of these girls is already exhibiting significant emotional, psychological, and other issues.
The oldest girl also exhibited inappropriate behavior by telling all far and wide that you were adopting them. Seeming to bond too quickly is just as much a problem of seeming to not bond at all. They are two sides of the same coin.
You KNOW that two of the girls were sexually abused. Generally it's not considered a good thing to bring abused kids into a home with younger children. Even if they have had therapy for it, no one can predict future behavior.
It would be very concerning to me that all three were fighting for your husband's attention. That could be a further sign of the sexual abuse.
You've stated that your husband has reservations.
Whenever we adopt it's a huge leap of faith, and no one knows what will happen down the road.
It's just that in this particular case there are SO many issues you already know about. This doesn't include the ones you don't.
Yes, it can be done, and yes, there are good outcomes. We just are suggesting that you look long and hard at what the very significant challenges are. When you look deep into your heart, you'll know what the answer is. And if the answer is yes, then none of what anyone else says matters.
This is from someone who adopted a toddler who had health issues that few children survived, AND had suffered extreme neglect for two years. There was no prognosis for her because no other child with her background had ever lived.
You sound like a loving, caring, and conscientious Mom. There are kids out there for you to mother. Just maybe not these three girls.
The Psycho-Quack's office is now closed. :eyebrows:
Adopting older children is fine, it is the adption of children older than your bios that will be devastating most likely. All it takes is one time for you to see your bio suffering physically, or emotionally and you will feel so powerless. It is a traumatic experience because helping 3 very needy girls is great but you will hate yourself for putting the bios at risk. You cannot jeopordise them.
We adopted a boy older than our bios and had to disrupt because we could see the others going downhill. At least when the troubled child is younger, then the other kids in the family are strong enough to handle whatever is going to be dished out behaviourally. They know better and have a better understanding. These troubled kids are not leader material. And lets face it the oldest is usually the leader.
There are so many families that are looking to adopt that have much older kids and likewise there are many sibling groups out there that are younger than your bios. Pleeeease be so careful.
Thank you all. All of what you are saying makes so much sense and it really helps. We have never been through this, and it really helps us make a good sound decision. It helps to hear what impact it would have on our bio daughters to bring in older children. We too worry about the middle one. That is our hestiation. To hear others that have experience so much, it seems to validate our reservations about the middle one. I would never want to part my daughters in harms way, and that is way I wrote here, to see if someone who has experience this could tell us if it would be a mistake or not bringing in older then our bio girls.
I truly thank all of your great advice. I was not looking for someone to say "Yes go for it" I was hoping to see all of the good and the bad. And I truly think you all are giving us the honest feedback that we need to make the right decisions on this. I really am starting to think that these 3 would not be right, I love my bio girls too much to ever risk them being harm. Our journey has not reached it's end...we know that the perfect (not really perfect but right) match for our family is out there. And I really, really do appreciate all of the honest and caring feedback, that is truly what we need to help with on this journey and we thank you all so much.
I will back for sure, so that we can get caring feedback like you all have given our family.
Ok, I have to jump in here. We have adopted children the same age as our birth children and we have also adopted children who were older than our younger two birth children. Our son had attachment issues and was diagnosed with RAD. He was a challenge, but we found creative ways to meet his needs and keep everyone safe in the process. If you had read our children's file (sib group of 3) everyone here would have told us to RUN!!! They were by far the easiest to parent. Our son who's file was an "easy" read was so much more difficult to parent. I would do it again in a heartbeat!!! That being said, we did have fostering experience and knew what to expect. We read everything we could get our hands on regarding attachment and adoption. Our children have come so far and are truly worth every single moment of struggle. It does take both parents to make things work, but maybe your husband was expressing his own insecurities. There were times when I wondered what we had gotten ourselves into, but it has all worked out. Not by magic, but through a great deal of work. In the beginning, I didn't feel all warm and fuzzy towards some of my children. Those feelings have evolved over time and I am most certainly head over heels now. :love: Ok, not everyday, but most. :evilgrin: Just go into things with realistic expectations and surround yourself with support.
Advertisements
Thank you so much for your side, it is really great to hear from your side. We talked to the 3 girls counselor yesterday, and my husband and I have decided we are going to go for it. I really think what my husband needed was to hear the issues and how to work with them from their actually counselor.
Thank you for your story. It makes me think that we are doing what is right. We have a huge support system and I am calling a family therapist/indiv therapist one that specializes in adoption families and one that will be able to continue working with what the girls have been working on.
This feels right, not to just me but to my husband also.
How wonderful for you and DH to finally have peace about your decision... sometimes it's a true leap of faith needed and then you can conquer the rest together.
If I might offer my own advice, coming from a foster parent who has lots of different ages coming in...
If you have the option, if your 9yr olds are in the same grade and there are at least two classes for that same grade, request they have different teachers. Although it's a LOT more work to keep up with an additional teacher and different school work I've found that if my same grade kids share the same teacher there are more problems. If you're in a small school it might not be an option, but if at all possible I'd request this accomodation.
Another poster mentioned bedrooms. You didn't mention bedroom space, but for the first year I wouldn't have your bio children share the same room as your new children. Not only because of the prior posters concern but also because they will each need time for healthy venting and to get away from each other. With that said, I wouldn't put a child (or sibling set) in a room that feels physically separated from everyone else (such as most bedrooms downstairs and only one upstairs.) If that is your only option then please consider putting yourself and DH in that physically separated room.
In addition, I'd take out all media in their rooms (such as TV's) which will force everyone to congregate together.
... and for my last bit of advice. During this upcoming 5 day visit I would recommend you stay home and keep it as boring and "normal" as possible. Divide out chores that will become everyone's responsibility with the understanding there is no $$ for doing it... you do it because you are a family. Try living as a family, not as a family with 3 new guests.
Truly I'm excited for you to finally have a decision.