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I'm in an open adoption (well, almost adoption!) relationships with my fs' birthparents.
Some background- I've had baby since he was 10 days old. Bios didn't visit until he was 6 months old. They relinquished when he was 9 months old. We've had visits since then about once a month, usually at a Wendy's in birthparent's neighborhood (bios have no transportation, no $ for bus to meet at mall).
I've never had a discussion with them about groundrules for our visits (my rules would be that they must be sober and no lieing). Recently, they told me a really BIG lie about their new baby that left me feeling drawn into their dysfunctions, disappointed, and most of all, worried about this new baby.
Does anyone have any suggestions about how to go about discussing groundrules with them? I want to do this respectfully without offending them; but, if I offend them, so be it. My baby's safety is my 1st priority, not their feelings. Also, I will not let myself get drawn into their dysfuntion again!
I'll admit- I'm pretty angry about this lie and want to distance myself from them; but, if an open relationship is in my baby's best interest, I will keep our relationship.
BTW- in my state, open adoption is not enforcable by court- its private agreement between adoptive and birth parents.
Any advice?
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Get a notebook and make a journal about everything that happens on these once a month visits.
That way, when they lie, and you bust them on a lie, if it's not something you want to expose right away, you have what really happened versus what was said written down.
Time, Date, When, and Where and who said it and what you said are very key.
I know an open adoption isn't enforceable in your state...but if it EVER came to question or the parents tried to do anything in regards to it (say, if, you unfortunately had to close off contact or the new child came into the system), you have all the proof you need.
I could see this becoming very important if they did lose the new baby to the system and, say, you wanted to adopt it, and they didn't want you to adopt the child because you cut off contact...well, then your CW will have all the proof they need to see that the parent's point is moot.
Best of luck!
I am surprised that the lawyer didn't work that out during the adoption. Our caseworker helped us to work out an agreement and present it. I have it printed out, copies with bio-mom, her lawyer, the GAL, caseworker, our lawyer.... I also plan to send her a copy of it just prior to our first meeting, so that she cannot say that she didn't remember (like she's been saying at every team meeting for the last 2 years). Our agreement is very clear that if it is not followed, there are no warnings and we will move forward with what we feel is in the best interests for our kids. I don't plan to use it to eliminate visits - but if our boundaries are disrespected consistently, then we will do what we need to in order to enforce our rules, or we will end the visits. I will still send updates and photos - but all communication would then be through mail - and only at our disgression.
akcskye- the notebook idea is great- I never thought of this.
fosta- in my state, there is no "open adoption" so any visitation is privately arranged; the courts will not reinforce any agreements.
I've been thinking about asking them not to lie to me again, and think this may be wasted energy; they are pretty dysfunctional (but love their baby!), and I don't know if they are capable of being completely honest. But, maybe I'll selling them short. I already phoned mom and called her on the lie about the new baby. I think that is enough for now.
I'd still love some suggestions for groundrules in an open adoption!
I'm not in this situation yet, but I've been thinking about what kind of "rules" I would have if we decide to look for them. I think some of the most obvious would be top priority for me. 1.) Must be sober during ALL contacts. Even phone calls, if we allowed them. 2.) Birth Parents are the only ones invited to these visits. Not Aunt. Not grandma. Not friends. This may sound harsh but, aunt's already had her kids taken and grandma has a disease that can not be cured. I don't want to take the chance, of them catching something from her and they don't have any attachment to her. 3.) No gifts can be brought unless I approve them first. They can be in a gift bag, but not wrapped. The reason for this is because I want to be able to see what it is they are giving before the kids get it, to ensure that it's appropriate. 4.) They can tell them they love them when they go to leave. That's it. None of the "I cry at home all the time because I miss you so much" bull. My kids went through a LOT of guilt of this kind of stuff. I don't fault her for it originally but she knows how this effected the kids so it will not be tolerated. 4.) No disrespecting us, as the parents. 5.) No lying to us or the kids. This is disrepectful.
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I have met with my bdaughter and her amother and they lied to me during the visit. They lied about having a Drs appointment and therefore had to cut the visit short. I only discovered the "lie" because I saw them at the mall shopping soon after there are no DRs offices in that mall or nearby. Clearly, for whatever reason - shopping maybe? - they wanted to end our planned two hour visit. while the lie has hurt me, they did turn up - although I certainly don't trust them to tell the truth anymore.
So I guess it would be how much the lying effects you. ie does it put you and baby in danger? I really don't think that right now it sounds like a reason to stop visits.
If my bdaughter and her mother wanted to arrange a visit do you think I should say no because they lied to me?
That's tricky, green, because I was always raised with the notion of a liar is a potential thief and murderer.
I'm one for not having secrets or skeletons in my closet.
I would tell the adoptive mother that you saw her at the mall shortly after they cut the visit short (assuming that your visitation time isn't court ordered here) and that it hurt you to know that they felt they couldn't just tell you the truth.
I don't know how close you are to them, you could even say that you'd have gone with them if they would have liked and you 3 ladies had a "girls day out".
If you're not that close with them, just stick with "it hurt me, but I wanted to let you know that you can tell me the truth, about ANY thing"...because in all honesty...that adoptive mom has just taught hers and your daughter how to lie to get what she wants...and that's what's really sad...that's why I feel you should mention it to her rather than keep it in the recesses of your soul and not mention it.
greenbottles
I have met with my bdaughter and her amother and they lied to me during the visit. They lied about having a Drs appointment and therefore had to cut the visit short. I only discovered the "lie" because I saw them at the mall shopping soon after there are no DRs offices in that mall or nearby. Clearly, for whatever reason - shopping maybe? - they wanted to end our planned two hour visit. while the lie has hurt me, they did turn up - although I certainly don't trust them to tell the truth anymore.
So I guess it would be how much the lying effects you. ie does it put you and baby in danger? I really don't think that right now it sounds like a reason to stop visits.
If my bdaughter and her mother wanted to arrange a visit do you think I should say no because they lied to me?
It was about 5 years ago now when we opend the adoption so guess my chance was missed. I didn't say anything at the time because I didn't want them to close down the reunion. The thing that really hurt was that bdaughter was clearly "in" on the lie...ie she was probably behind it as with hindsight the amother appeared a bit guilty at the time. I also agree that amother has taught bdaughter to lie but then I know that has rebounded on her a few times since...lol I read some things on bdaughter's Myspace about how she lied to her parents about various things. (can't go into details but I am sure her parents were furious about one of her lies as it revolved around a safety issue with her car!)The reunion has sadly ended as bdaughter (now aged over 18) has not replied to any of my letters for sometime so I am not in contact with amother or bdaughter.
Mom2blessings
I'm not in this situation yet, but I've been thinking about what kind of "rules" I would have if we decide to look for them. I think some of the most obvious would be top priority for me. 1.) Must be sober during ALL contacts. Even phone calls, if we allowed them. 2.) Birth Parents are the only ones invited to these visits. Not Aunt. Not grandma. Not friends. This may sound harsh but, aunt's already had her kids taken and grandma has a disease that can not be cured. I don't want to take the chance, of them catching something from her and they don't have any attachment to her. 3.) No gifts can be brought unless I approve them first. They can be in a gift bag, but not wrapped. The reason for this is because I want to be able to see what it is they are giving before the kids get it, to ensure that it's appropriate. 4.) They can tell them they love them when they go to leave. That's it. None of the "I cry at home all the time because I miss you so much" bull. My kids went through a LOT of guilt of this kind of stuff. I don't fault her for it originally but she knows how this effected the kids so it will not be tolerated. 4.) No disrespecting us, as the parents. 5.) No lying to us or the kids. This is disrepectful.
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greenbottles
I have met with my bdaughter and her amother and they lied to me during the visit. They lied about having a Drs appointment and therefore had to cut the visit short. I only discovered the "lie" because I saw them at the mall shopping soon after there are no DRs offices in that mall or nearby. Clearly, for whatever reason - shopping maybe? - they wanted to end our planned two hour visit. while the lie has hurt me, they did turn up - although I certainly don't trust them to tell the truth anymore.So I guess it would be how much the lying effects you. ie does it put you and baby in danger? I really don't think that right now it sounds like a reason to stop visits. If my bdaughter and her mother wanted to arrange a visit do you think I should say no because they lied to me?