Need Advice Please!!

Thank you for your response! It IS a CPS case but is being handled via the tribe. The tribe does have total jurisdiction :( They are "suspending" her parental rights and after ten years if she jumps through their hoops, she will be able to have access to the children. The tribe claims we can adopt them with this "ten-year clause". This is very scary for us and I am not sure if I even want to consider it. I love these children but the 4 yr old is going to need life-long therapy for what she has been through and every time I act on behalf of the children (telling the judge to expedite the procedures because these children cannot even begin to heal until this court stuff is over with) I get SEVERLY reprimanded by the tribe. I guess I am at a total loss as to where to go from here... :(

Another note... you might get better responses if you posted this in the "foster parent support" forum.

Coming from an entirely selfish side :) if I was in your position, I would choose not to keep the children if the tribe continues to go down this route. Given the needs of the child and the possibility of RU with Mom I can't imagine how the temporariness of the situation is good for you and the child. Statistics show that it is best to have a child in a permanent stable home as soon as possible, but dragging it on for 10 years is incredibly long and damaging to the kids.

That is a shame. The whole process of foster care and reunification needs to be re-done to better protect the poor innocent children. I feel so sorry for you because that is a very hard decision.

Wow! The things that are done to children never cease to amaze me. (And I'm not just talking about prostituting a baby.) How is it adoption if you may have to give up your parental rights after 10 years?!? Hopefully someone else will jump in with advice about dealing with a tribal court. But as to the decision you have to make -- I don't know... a lot can happen in 10 years. But 10 years is also a really, really long time to be living your life in limbo. Do they feel like your children?

I am a CPS worker from MN. This is pretty common within tribal courts in regards to kids esp. if the family has a strong tribal connection. You did not indicate if you were an ICWA home or not. Though I am not really sure that it matters. I have heard (though not experienced) that the tribes are more willing to suspend parental rights rather than terminate because they do not want to lose the connection to the children. You can PM me if you have more questions since I am here in MN.

no I would not go through with it heartbreaking as it is- this birthmother wants YOU to raise the kids and shoulder her responsibility til she decides she wants to get involved. Your kids are eithers yours or they arent.

I had no idea that parental rights could be suspended like that. Can this be done outside of a tribal situation? I thought "adoption" was meant to be permanent. If the mother meets the conditions set forward, is there a TPR for the adoptive family. I'm really interested in learning more.

It sounds like you are being asked to sacrifice your emotions and feelings quite a bit. Not to mention living 10 years with your life on hold. I think they really need you and it is a blessing that they can be with you, if you can handle it. Clearly they need you and now you must ask yourself honestly if you are strong enough to be there for them. I for one hope you are strong enough to take this path and do the best you can with what you have. You should also talk to them about how they think that this "parent" could possibly prove she will not do the same thing to them if she ever got them back let alone actually being a true and caring parent. Good luck.

Praying for you and these dear children. I have only begun the process of adoption and so I cannot speak from any kind of experience. I just felt compelled to tell you that I think it is wonderful that you are even considering this journey. These children need someone who will fight for them, love them, and teach them what real love and real life looks like. Perhaps that person is you, no one can tell you what to do. I will be praying for you. Be strong, follow your heart.

What's the longest period of time you've had children in your home, as a parent, that you then gave up?I'm asking to see if you are advising this person to do something you've done, and therefore speak from experience? Or if you are speaking in theory?

In your experience, what usually happens at the 10-year mark? Separately, can you refer us to any statistics on this?Finally, does it make a difference to the tribe if the potential adoptive family is willing and eager to maintain a relationship with the tribe, as the children's birth rights? Is the tribe more likely to ask for this if they feel the potential adoptive family doesn't wish to maintain tribal connections?

I agree with everybody else on here. Sometimes as much as we try our very best to help these children, fall in love with them, and want to keep them, it is not best for us, nor them. This is one of those situations. Yes, this mom wants you to raise her kids until they are old enough to "basically, fend for themselves". That is totally stupid. Tribal or not, Totally Stupid. If that child was indeed prostituted, that mom or anyone around her should have NO RIGHTS! That includes the tribe, because if she had that close of a "connection" to the tribe, how come they didn't see anything wrong with what she was doing? The whole case sounds a little fishy to me actually. I am a foster parent and foster to adopt, so I know how hard it is to give children back to their parents, let alone give them back to the system because of reasons beyond our control. But this one is for a very good reason. Tell them to you will not agree to those provisions. Once you adopt a child, it is your decision whether they even get to keep contact with anybody. For God Sakes not even Grandparents get rights anymore, why should a mom who prostituted her kids. Please gals/guys write your Legislators about what is happening within these systems, do it anonymously if you have too. But help the system to become better for these children. They are moved around like monopoly figures, given back to parents who then maim and kill them, etc., they should have rights too. Sorry this is so long, but lately I am hearing so much junk about the system "everywhere" that it really bothers me that no one goes higher up. Good luck keep us posted!:confused:

Some random thoughts, maybe not helpful. You know, in general I am a huge advocate of First Nation rights. But this is cruel and ridiculously stupid. I wouldn't pin such stupidity just on First Nations, though, as we have heard similar nonsense about RU with perpetrators from everyday foster situations despite protections built into federal regulations and state laws. Why isn't the mother in prison? And if she is, how long will she be there? And if she isn't, why isn't she being prosecuted criminally? Surely "tribal law" can't protect her from this? As you know, the proposed situation would be very damaging to the children as they grow up. Children need permanency for psychological health. To live the next 10 years knowing you have no claim on your own life, identity, home, family, etc., will do great damage and could even cause mental illness--it is forced disassociation, a forced sense of impermanence and unreality. If they don't know, they will be living in a home with a toxic secret, also no good. Somebody needs to get a psychologist to explain this to whoever in the tribe is proposing this cruel and inhumane nonsense that clearly violates the childrens' rights under the UN charter and US laws. I understand that it is a tribal situation, but no one from the tribe stepped up to protect and nurture these kids. There is no rehabilitation, no redemption in the world the mother could achieve that would make it psychologically safe for these children to ever be reunited with her in a living situation. She is a criminal, her childrens' perpetrator, it would be insufferably cruel to put the threat of RU over their heads for the next 10 years. She could become Mother Theresa, she would not be a safe person for them. Ever. It's not about rehabilitation or forgiveness, it is about the permanent trauma the children will live with. I would wish her all the best in overcoming whatever pushed her to commit these crimes against her children, but she will NEVER be safe for them no matter how safe she becomes for society in general. I guess I would respond with that and have a psychologist or psychiatrist (not just a therapist) in tow to explain and verify it all. I would focus on making a commitment to maintaining a connection to the tribe, not the mother. I would promise to enroll the children in language and culture classes if available. I would promise to bring them to special events (with some caveats re safety). I would take a good long look at extended family and figure out who is safe and to be trusted to keep boundaries and I would commit to some kind of relationship with them (again, some caveats need to go with that). I wonder, also, what the force of law would be on 12 and 14 year olds who don't want to be reunited? Would they take children of that age by force? Because they won't want to go. How would the tribe be likely to handle that? What age does the tribe consider old enough to be self-determining? Is that codified in some way? Could it be written in that the children won't have to go if they don't want to? They sound as if they are your children. It sounds as if there is nowhere else for them to go for now except another home such as yours that will have the same issue and want to make the same arguments. In the meantime, the kids will have suffered a disruption. I wonder how long the situation can go on with negotiations, how long until it just doesn't make sense for the tribe to insist on possible RU? Or do they just show up and remove kids? I'd want to know more about how things happen and what constitutes due process for the children. Now I'm really rambling. Maybe there's a nugget in there somewhere that's helpful. I hope so. Good luck.

Hadley, thank you. What a mouth full. Couldn't have said it better myself. Finally someone who thinks like me. I remember a worker telling me one day, that I shouldn't worry so much because after all, "this is the only system we got". :hissy: