Need advice for Birth Parent visit

Have the kids already been adopted? I think you said you still have a caseworker so technically you are still foster parents and must follow through with visits. If they are adopted, behavior like that would end visits for an indefinite period of time.

Here is the timeline of events: There was already an open CPS case on the oldest child from the time she was about 14 months. March 2009 the youngest is born (my step-brothers) November 2009 birthmom overdosed and CPS removed kids Kids are placed with maternal aunt who gets a DWI with kids in the car. Kids are removed and put into traditional foster care awaiting homestudy on my parents. early December 2009 Kids are placed with my dad and stepmom who is the paternal grandmother of the youngest. they agree to short term placement mid December 2009 birthparents walk out of rehab and kids need a longterm placement Drug tests come back and all four are positive. The oldest was at a high level and youngest was at a critical level for meth. Not one charge against the parents has ever come down. The DA refused to press charges even when we brought it up. So for all they've put these kids through they have been free to walk around and do as they want. April 2010 kids are placed with us December 2010 we are moved to the adoption unit of CPS May 2011 our adoption is finalized. Our adoption is final. We no longer have caseworkers and have not had any since finalization of our adoption this past May. The way the visitation order came about was this: My step-brother, the youngest child's birth dad got a visitation order that would consist of a 2 hour visit every other weekend and would become totally null and void once the adoption was finalized. From then, the visits would be totally at our discretion since he was a family member. Birth mom showed up to court to sign relinquishment papers. She found out about my brothers arrangement. I'm not sure how she found out but she did. Anyway, then she refused to sign unless we gave her a visitation deal and she wanted every other weekend until the kids were 18. We told her absolutely not, that was not happening that we would go thru a jury trial before doing that. Our main concern is we didn't want to drag the oldest through a jury trial. So anyway, CPS said they would take care of it...literally about 10 mintues later court started and we are the first case in front of a judge and are told CPS put in the the standard visitation order for her which is up to a 4 hour visit on each of the kids birthdays and a visit during the Christmas holiday to take place every year until their 18th birthday if she can provide a clean hair follicle in advance of the visit. So that's how the order came about. It kinda stinks!!! I never intended to keep them out of any of the birth parents lives as long as they were acting right. Birthmom threw a fit about all that and then disappeared (at this point she had not seen them since June of 2010) only to come back into their lives last month for the oldest birthday. The only reason then is she is pregnant and clean. She has stayed clean during all of her pregnancies (this is the 4th and she doesn't have any of the previous three. We have 2 and one child between them died of heart complications...family member belive drugs but birthmom says it was something congenital on the dads side) She goes right back to the drugs, and everything else within 2 months of delivering each of them. So, now she is wanting a Christmas visit. This wouldn't be an issue if she had of just followed the guidlelines we laid down before the birthday visit. I know I can't control her behavior. I am more or less trying to end her power struggle and let her know we are the parents now and call her on all the manipulation that she is doing to the children and trying to do to us. I spoke with our lawyer and she said she didn't even think it was legally binding since we didn't sign anything but then my step-mom brought up a good point. Since at the time we went to court, the kids were still in the custody of CPS even though they were living with us, they could still make all decisions for them until the order of adoption was actually finalized. These rules are just to try and minimize the effects of her selfishness and manipulation so that the effect of the kids will be minimal. Just to give a little more background....the birthmom is now 23 I think and a habitual user of prescription drugs and would take them then lock the kids in dog cages so she could go sleep. Then her use escalated to meth. Then they started cooking meth. We knew stuff was going on but not exactly what and had no idea it was to the extent it was until after the fact. She had been in one CPS case or another ever since the oldest was 14 months old. The oldest was almost 3 when she they were removed. She wouldn't change their diapers to the point feces and stick to their bottom and skin and all would come off. The oldest was hospitalized 8 times from 7 months to 18 months of age under her care. I found this out after getting the HESIGH report. We didn't know her before she became pregnant with my step-brothers child. When everything came to surface in Novemeber of 2009, the oldest then 2 years old was found walking in the front yard near a busy highway by herself and birthmom had OD'd on meth. They took her to the hospital which she walked out when the nurse wasn't looking. Through the course of CPS she would sign a plan and work it for a few weeks then when they were about to turn her over for termination of rights, that day she would show up and sign another plan and we would go through the whole process again. It was a horrible time. My frustration is I know people do and have changed but I am not seeing any change in her attitude and she is still hanging around and talking to the same people. I fear it is only a matter of time after this baby she carrying is born that she will go right back to her old behaviors and disappear out of the kids lives again. I just don't think it's right that she disappears only to reappear years later and think she can walk right in and take up where she left off. Not to mention, the new baby. I just know we are not in a place to take on the responsibility of another child (we have these two and two birth children also, all 10 and under) and I fear for that unborn child. If something happens though, the fathers family will have to take care of it. I guess I'm starting to ramble now...so I'll end for now. Hope the background has helped.

OP: do you have a copy of the open adoption agreement? Usually there is some clause that ends visits if BPs are no shows for a certain period of time.

That is so inappropriate. Does the 5 yr old have any memories of abuse? I hate it when messed up adults act like the child has the control over who they live with (my daughter's bdad repeatedly told her she chose to go into foster care and be adopted, it would make her so upset/angry!). What a burden to put on a little kid, and how frightening it can be for them. My daughter's bdad, via facebook messages when she was 11, told her she was old enough to decide to live with him, and said he was going to have the police pick her up and he would get custody. I took the messages to court and got a permanent restraining order against any contact whatsoever (but he is a really bad guy, I'm not saying you should do that in your situation).

There is not a clause that mentions if she misses so many visits then she doesn't get anymore. Yes, the 5 year old does remember everything and up until a few months ago could tell us everything in detail. She has been through play therapy and more useful than that, the therapist gave me the tools to deal with the trauma she had experienced. It really really helped along with a lot of prayer, love and listening instead of reacting when she did act out. I have noticed in the last few months her memories are beginning to blur and she is getting events mixed up so I'm thankful for that. I'm praying that after a few more years her memories will fade even more of all the traumas she has had to endure. Upon seeing birthmom for the first time in so long, after we returned home she had small meltdown and just held on to me and asked if she was going to have to leave. I reassured her and reminded her that her last name is our name now and I'm not letting her go anywhere. A smile came on her face and she has been okay for the most part. Like I said, if she had not been so settled, it could have been really devastating to her. I just know if those behavior continue especially so close it could really do harm which is why I am trying to get on top of it before this visit. I honestly think that after she has this next baby at the end of April she will go on with her life and not think twice about these two at least that will be the pattern if history repeats itself.

I understand that the mother had lost her rights and the children are now safe and secure. Thank God. The fact is the children do know that woman is their mother. You can't pretend or try to take that fact away. Adoption is traumatic for mother and child. Ideally if the mother didn't endanger and harm her children they would still be together. Prayers are sent to all parties. I think the fact that the mother broke down is just a testament to her pain. Yes, she blew it... I am not siding with her. I want your daughters not to feel rejection and abandonment. It might be uncomfortable for you to face that she is their mother but for the sake of the children it may help them heal if they do have interaction. They didn't ask for any of this. It's not their fault their mother did what she did. I am not an expert or know what's best. I am just wondering how can you integrate the mother into their lives in some way that works for all of you...so that later the children do not feel rejected or forsaken. It is natural for you to want to protect you dear little ones. It is also natural for your children to want to know their origins and first parents. I wonder if the meetings should be with a therapist or something. I hope this works out for all of you. Best wishes.

We have always maintained an open conversation with the kids about her being their birth mom. They are free to say and do whatever concerning her with us. I have not tried to keep her away from them...she chose that herself. She has to realize that she can't disappear for 2 years and then walk right back in with all that she did to them and expect that they are not going to act differently to her. The oldest has a lot of memories of her and what she did to her and is very fearful of her. We never speak bad of her and we answer all of the oldest's questions honestly but carefully so we don't cross a line to speak badly of birthmom. I even made her a lifebook with pictures of everyone. There are members of her birth family that have chosen to stay in her life and she has a good healthy relationship with them. Birthmom just continuously refuses to put the kids above herself and chooses to operate with her own selfish desires. I mean, she knows the terms of the adoption and visitations yet she tries to still plant seed asking a 5 year old when she's gonna live with her again knowing full well its not going to happen. Not all birthmoms have the best interest of their children in mind and that is what we are dealing with.

I think I'd take this back to court and see if you can get this arrangement revoked. It's ridiculous to be held to a court order of this nature with an addict. It's not possible to do visits every bday, especially as your dd grows up. What if dd says one day "I want a party with just my friends and don't want her there!" Forcing a relationship with an unhealthy person is just insane and I'm sorry you have to do it.

I am so sorry that you are dealing with this. I hope the mother gets her act together for the kids. The children are certainly blessed to have you in their lives! I have a great deal of respect for what you are doing to nurture your children.

I feel for you as I adopted my husbands nephew as he was a victim of SBS at 2 months old. My Sister in Law (SIL) never came to visit with him in then 5 years we have had him unless it was court ordered. He only knows me as his mother but yet when we do see her at family gatherings she insists on telling him she is his mother. He tells her no that is my mommy. She now thinks that I should let her come and take him when and wherever she wants. He is a 5 year old austic boy who has many social issues that she has no idea how to handle. Of course now I AM THE BAD GUY as I wont let her. But I will be that bad guy in order to keep MY SON safe and happy. Stay strong and put her in her place (of course when the children are not around) but do it gently as in a few months when she is back on drugs you may be able to get the baby on the way. Stay Strong

I never updated everyone. We met birthmom ahead of the visit without the kids. I told her everything was typed up so we could all be clear on what was expected from every one involved. She signed the paper and said she understood. We then went and got the kids and brought them for a visit. She was fine. I felt the visit went well and that she was appropriate the whole time. Her next visit will be the end of March for the youngests birthday. I pray it goes just as well but now I feel better wiyh things knowing the ground rules are laid and are clearly understood. She will be 8 months pregnant at that point so I'm sure before we go I will need to have that dreaded discussion with all the kids. As far as this baby IF she goes back to drugs, there is just no way we can take on the responsibility of another child. Financially, taking on two more in addition to the two we already had nearly killed us. We were considered kinship and received no help after it was promised. Having said that though, I would do it over in a heartbeat if I had it to do over again. I don't regret it at all we just are not in a position to be able to care for another child. The fathers family would have to step up at that point.

I suggest the birthmom make a video for the girls. You can preview and approve or disapprove it before showing it to the girls. If all goes well then maybe supervised Skype sessions would be wise. you can always turn it off if it isn't working out. if bmom can sustain a healthy conversation withthe girls (on their level) then consider a supervised visit.

She doesn't have access to any of that. All of our visits with her have been supervised. She is not allowed unsupervised visits by the court order and we don't allow them either. Every visit is supervised by myself or my hudband and I together. Besides, this is something I need to talk to them about...just because it is unvomfortable doesn't mean I'm going to give her that control or I.fluence. I will deal with it. I have just waited for the oldeat childs sake. She turned 5 not that long ago and has had to deal with so much. I wanted her to be able to deal with and process the firat few visits without having to deal with the fact birthmom is pregnant again. When she haf memories of a baby that died that was born between her and her sister she grieved for about 3 weeks. It hasn't been that long ago. I'm not trying to skirt the topic, I just want to be able to help her thru one thing at a time.

Thats a tough question. If you ask me the birth mother sounds like she has a screw loose. Maybe you need to go back to the judge with your lawyer and explain what she is doing during her visits and tell him that it is NOT in the best interest of the child .,....for the child to experience this type of disturbing behavior. Eventually..i feel that the child will become traumatized.

What a difficult situation. I am glad she chose to sign the document and that she acted appropriately during the last visit. I wouldn't worry to much about the future or about the new baby coming. Just take things one visit at a time and see how things go. People do change. Try and think positively. The important thing right now is that your kids are safe and secure with you. If things become inappropriate in the future again I'm sure you will handle it just as well. People can't be perfect. There was a reason her kids aren't with her now. She may very well make mistakes in the future. Hopefully they won't be anything to serious and you will be able to talk about it and work through it like you did this last time. If not, cross that bridge when you get to it.Best of luck to you and in your upcoming visit.