Threadgold

Memorial Inscriptions for Winsford United Reformed Congregational, Winsford, Cheshire Hubert husband of Edith THREADGOLD died 19 sep 1945 age 67. Also Edith died 15 may 1956 age 74. at [url]http://homepage.ntlworld.com/laura.vizard/mypage2.htm[/url] looking at Ediths death date, that coincides with the threadgolds no longer being at their address, maybe they travelled to Winsford prior to her death, maybe she was ill?

Thanks Sarahlee, do you happen to know if Winsford is anywhere near Over in Cheshire where Frank Threadgold originally came from. I think Over is near Northwich. Fairly certain the Threadgolds returned to Manchester after leaving the south of England but their "daughters" did not, Penelope I know was in care in the early 1960s don't know for sure what happened to Cynthia. I surmised that they could have been part of the Child Migration Scheme to Australia. Or even 10 Poms, hence my post here. Whatever they have disapeared from the face of the UK Robin

[url]http://www.multimap.com/map/browse.cgi?GridE=-2.54700&GridN=53.18610&client=public&lon=-2.54700&lat=53.18610&place=Over,Cheshire&db=freegaz&local=&type=&start=&limit=&overviewmap=&scale=100000&lang=&db=freegaz[/url] Basically they are very close - about a mile apart, and theyre only 32/33 miles from Withington, which at the time could have been possibly the largest nearest hospital? There were quite a few other Threadgolds in Winsford, probably any there now are relatives of Frank. It might pay to contact them.

Thanks Sarahlee I've had a look at Frank's birth certificate, They are his parents. So that info will help me in the search for other relatives of his. Are you researching the Threadgold name or that area? I need to find out what brothers and in Frank's case more specifically sisters, Frank & Hilda had. I need to find out who the girl's natural parents are. I think they could have been nieces. Robin

Robin, I have done quite a lot of geneaology for different family members in the UK, and they moved around a lot and didnt believe in middle names, so I have become quite deft with some of the tools online (could save hours at the main registry in London), plus I travelled quite extensively around the UK when I lived there for 4 years. And I have found that going backwards will often help you move forward - like you said they may have been siblings children (or cousins children) and sometimes though locations may be in different Counties etc sometimes they are only a few miles apart. You might want to check out the Comonwealth War Graves it may give further insight into Threadgolds of Winsford. There are several listed there [url]http://www.cwgc.org/cwgcinternet/search.aspx[/url] for instance: THREADGOLD, CLARENCE MEADHAM 12/07/1946 Son of Clarence and Jessie Florence Threadgold, of Higher Crumpsall, Manchester THREADGOLD, FRED 25/08/1918 Son of Charles and Mary Threadgold, of Winsford; husband of Frances Threadgold, of 143, High St., Winsford, Cheshire. THREADGOLD, HARRY 23/09/1942 Son of Harry and Caroline Threadgold, of Winsford, Cheshire, England. THREADGOLD, HARRY 09/10/1917 Son of Henry and Ada Threadgold, of 152, Stockport Rd., Denton, Manchester. THREADGOLD, RALPH 08/07/1945 Son of Samuel and Alice Threadgold, of Manchester; husband of Marion Helen Threadgold, of Cheetham Hill, Manchester. THREADGOLD W T 23/10/1918 Cheshire Regiment For instance another death on that page Ada Elizabeth wife of Charles THREADGOLD of Winsford died 26 jan 1939 age 67. Also Charles husband died 9 apr 1943 age 71. Also Mary their daughter and wife of William WILSON died 12 mar 1951 age 50. Their daughter Mary died in 1951 possibitlity of being a relative, if Mary was Franks cousin he may have taken in any children (this is just supposition) Another option I thought of was if either of them simply changed their name - for instance became a nun.

Thanks again Sarahlee The following from the memorial inscriptions at Winsford Congregational Church caught my eye, Ada Elizabeth wife of Charles THREADGOLD of Winsford died 26 jan 1939 age 67. Also Charles husband died 9 apr 1943 age 71. Also Mary their daughter and wife of William WILSON died 12 mar 1951 age 50. At only 50 Mary was still young enough to have been the girls' mother. So I shall check to see if there were any girls registered as Cynthia and Penelope Wilson in relevant years. Frank's family seem to have had a tradition of using the mother's maiden surname as the child's middle name. Hence, Frank Lloyd Threadgold, whose mother's maiden was Edith Parry Lloyd. I note the name Parry is also on the memorial list. The nun theory is interesting, but the mystery in this case is why Frank and Hilda are talking of their daughters Penelope and Cynthia who where 7 and 12 years old in early 1954 yet there are no births of Threadgold children with those names recorded on the registers for either England & Wales or Scotland. Also I can find no record of a Penelope or Cynthia Threadgold ever marrying in the appropriate period in England & Wales. The only other proof of their existence that I have is reply to one of my message on the internet, from someone who was in the 'Seaview Children's Home' Shoeburyness with a Penelope Threadgold (nick-named Fred) in the early 1960s when they were both about 14. Seaview was a complex of four large houses my brother was in the same "home" but in a different house, he does not remember Penelope. I met his house and later adoptive mother (and sister), I asked her if she knew anything about the Threasgolds and I'm sure she said to her daughter "wasn't that Cynthia's name" at that time I didn't know the girls' first names. At least I have a little more to work with now. Hilda's maiden name was Coverley in case I forgot to mention in the original post she was from Stretford / Trafford and they married in a Methodist chapel in Stretford which was then in the district of Barton county of Lancaster (Lancashire) but is now part of Greater Manchester. Robin

That should be V Arashoon (not Ashroon) Robin Harritt [url]http://harritt.net[/url]

I've just posted this to the other forums where I had posted the original message, thought I'd better include it here as well as this is the only forum that has produced a responce so far (thanks Sharalee) despite the fact that those reading it are halfway around the world. Still hoping I might find an explanation for the disapearance of Penelope and Cynthia. And of course, the more places I post this the more it will be seen on all the search engines. So, fingers crossed. When I first posted this I deliberately left out a fair amount of detail from my account in case I was barking up the wrong tree and someone somewhere knew different. I also had to consider the possibility that one or other of the senior Threadgolds were still alive. So I'll try to give the whole story now. Frank and Hilda when they were in Southend wanted to adopt they had been my 'parents' for much longer than my natural mother. See letter that leaked from Barnardos: [url]http://robin.robin.org/~tl[/url] In letters to Southend Children's Officer Frank signs himself Frank Threadgold and in letter to Barnardos he states that he 'has good work as a bricklayer'. Frank appears in Kelly's Directory for Southend as bricklayer until the 1957 edition that would have been compiled in 1956. I've checked the Calendar of Deed Polls, nothing there, they could of course have changed their names by statutory declaration, which is much more common in recent years, the only record of that would be a document in their own possession and perhaps a copy at the office of a solicitor somewhere. I have checked the marriages indexes from about 1910 to 1954 as no indication is given in letters of their ages. There is only one marriage of a Frank Threadgold to a Hilda, that took place at what looks like Gorse Hill Methodist Chapel, Stretford(?) (or could be Shefford) in the district of Barton, County of Lancaster, on the 18th May 1940. I don't know much about that area. The marriage certificate shows clearly that that Frank's full name was Frank Lloyd Threadgold his 'Rank or Profession' at that time was 'Crane Driver at a Dynamo Manufacturers'. Hilda's maiden name was Coverly. One of the witnesses was a V. Arashoon again the registrar's writing is not good, the only reference that I have been able to find for that name is a single entry in the Electoral Register for Delhi where it appears to be a middle name. Frank's father was a 'Boot and Shoe Repairer' Working back, this Frank's birth certificate shows that he was born in Over near Northwich Cheshire on 'Thirtieths September 1910'. Name and surname and maiden name of mother, Edith Parry Threadgold formerly *Lloyd* which is where the Lloyd comes from, it was common in that area to use the mother's maiden name as a middle name. Hilda Coverley was born 24th July 1910 in the District of Manchester sub-district of Ancoats at 122 Sandal Street the daughter of an Iron Turner one John Coverly and his wife Ada nee Webster. Frank Lloyd Threadgold died 6th January 1969 at Withington Hospital, again the copy of the certificate is not good but the informant is Hilda Threadgold and her address appears to be '76 Bishop Sans Manchester 16' though the 'Sans' could be something completely different it is a very blurred copy, but it is quite clear that his occupation is given as Bricklayer. In the time for which death indexes are available in digital form (from 1984?) seven Hilda's with the date of birth of 24 July 1910 have died. Hilda Lloyd is the only one in the Manchester area (thanks to Mike at Peopletracer UK for looking that up for me). Hilda Lloyd's death certificate shows the following. That she died 22 December 1989 at Withington Hospital, Manchester. The entry for maiden surname is crossed trough. Occupation and usual address states; Widow of ---- Lloyd (no given name stated) Occupation Unknown. Withington Hospital, Manchester is given as her usual address. The informant is James Fitton his 'Qualification' is given as 'Occupier' and his usual address as Withington Hospital Manchester. She died of bronco-pneumonia, certified by M. Islam MBBS. I was never able to find a death or re-marriage for Hilda Threadgold and she has not appeared on recent Electoral registers. At the time of my adoption the G ad L tried to find the Threadgolds at their last known address in York Rd., Southend they were no longer there, that was May 1956. In their letters to Southend Borough Children's Officer, Frank and Hilda state that they have daughters Penelope and Cynthia who were seven and twelve years old in 1954, however there are no records of births in the relevant years in England and Wales or in Scotland for a Penelope or Cynthia Threadgold. There have been no marriages in England and Wales of either a Penelope or Cynthia Threadgold. I am told by someone who has seen my post on the LookupUK website that she was in the children's home in Shoeburyness with a Penelope Threadgold in in 1961 when she was 14 this is the same children's home that my brother grew up in but in different house, he does not remember her. Barnardos have stated that the Threadgolds were not considered as adopters because their housing was inadequate, however they were living on one floor of a large house that I visited many times in my childhood and teens and long before I knew very much about all of this. It had by then become an old peoples home, where the elderly aunt of a family friend was residing. Then much of what Barnardos have to say about this, is less than believable. The Social Services at Southend simply say that the adoption was not considered appropriate. Whatever, my birth mother was with me for only the first six weeks of my life, the Threadgolds for the first eight months, I have always considered them my first parents and feel that I have as much right to know about them as I do to know about my birth mother. Barnardos was *very* upset that one of its social workers gave me any information at all about the Threadgolds and managers there even considered trying to take action against the local authority for doing so, but I did not feel inclined to co-operate with them in that effort. I've always considered that I was pretty much kidnapped from the Threadgolds who appear to all accounts to have been a very kindly couple. Records that I have seen, make it clear that the Borough Children's Officer, Doris Ridd was very much against the Threadgolds being considered for adoption, even though everyone else involved was prepared to consider them, my guess is that she was concerned that they would remain in contact with my birth mother. The only other possible objection that I know of is some allegations about the disappearance of a family allowance book, but not as far as I know, any suggestion of fraud. Obviously I still have no proof that the Threadgolds from Manchester are the same Threadgolds as those in Southend, but given the disappearance of the Southend Threadgolds it does seem likely to me that they are the same people. Threadgold is a relatively common name in the south east Essex area compared to rest of the country, but most of the Threadgolds in SE Essex are a good deal more affluent than Frank and Hilda appear to have been, another Frank Threadgold in that area was according to his Will a wealthy landowner with race horses amongst his estate, but not it would appear ever married to a Hilda. I am speculating that Hilda who died in Withington Hospital was destitute and senile and the death certificate has been filled out as best as anyone was able to with limited information available, by the manager of the unit she was in. I hope that all explains more fully and that anyone who can throw any further light on this will contact me. Robin Harritt [url]http://harritt.net[/url]

In fact it's Arathoon (really bad handwriting on the certificate) a Bengali name originally I believe but common in Cheshire! I Think we might have found this lady's daughter (thanks John & R). Still no sign of Penelope and Cynthia though. [url]http://robin.robin.org/search/bmd.html[/url] [url]http://robin.robin.org/search[/url] [url]http://robin.robin.org/barnardos[/url] Robin *

Just bringing this back to the top. Some of the links in the posts above might no longer work, you can see my story on the following links. [url]http://barnardos.harritt.net/[/url] [url]http://search.harritt.net[/url] [url]http://barnardos.harritt.net/barnardos[/url] Robin call +44 20 7871 1835 Fax +44 20 7691 9668 *